Event highlights autism, vaccines
By Jill Coley
A recent autism conference in Charleston boldly touted a claim that mainstream science largely has put to rest: a link between the developmental disorder and vaccines.
The three-day International Vaccine Risk Symposium was hosted by the American Chiropractic Autism Board, a group formed last year by Charleston-based chiropractor Renee Tocco.
In addition to presentations on vaccines and seminars for the general public, chiropractors and medical doctors focused on nontraditional autism therapies such as diet and hyperbaric oxygen chambers.
"We're bringing everything to the table that's helping children recover," Tocco said. "Every child is different so you have to find out what is going on with that individual child."
However, Dr. Laura Carpenter, a clinical psychologist at the Medical University of South Carolina, said, "I have concerns with treatments that don't have theoretical underpinnings."
As long as treatments are safe, such as a gluten-free diet, Dr. Jane Charles does not take issue with them. Whatever parents try, it's important for them to tell their doctors, said Charles, a developmental behavioral health pediatrician at MUSC.
Autism is a spectrum disorder, meaning that it affects each person differently and to varying degrees. While its cause remains unproved, it's pretty clear genetics play a role, Carpenter said.
The controversy ignited in the late 1990s following a study described in The Lancet that proposed a connection between the measles-mumps-rubella, or MMR, vaccine and autism.
A review of more than 12 large studies in five countries concluded that no data supported that link, according to Dr. Paul Offit, chief of infectious diseases at the Children's Hospital of Philadelphia and author of the book "Autism's False Prophets."
Another hypothesis pointed the finger at thimerosal, which was removed from nearly all vaccines about eight years ago, according to Carpenter.
A third reasoning now gaining popularity is that vaccines overwhelm the immune system. Carpenter, however, pointed to the purity of vaccines today compared with those in the past.
In 1985, doctors vaccinated for seven diseases using 3,000 antigens, she said. Today, health care providers can vaccinate against 16 diseases using only 200 antigens.
On Thursday while preparing for the conference, Tocco said that the keynote speaker, Dr. Andrew Moulden, a brain specialist from Canada, would present research that hasn't been linked together before. His hypothesis centers on vaccines slowing the blood in an effect called "blood sludging."
While Tocco also thinks there is a connection between autism and vaccines, she said it is likely multi-causal. "Over the years, so many have pointed at so many components in vaccines," she said.
It is that unfocused rationale that scientists eschew. Charles said scientists prefer theories that can be tested in double-blind experiments with a placebo control group.
Vaccines are a good thing, and that we have so many now is a public health success, Charles said. It's important for everyone to get them so the public can develop what's called a "herd immunity."
But when parents choose not to vaccinate, they put others at risk, Charles said. "They are dumping on the community to protect their child."
Reach Jill Coley at 937-5719 or jcoley@postandcourier.com.
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bcollette (anonymous) says...
Quoted: "Vaccines are a good thing, and that we have so many now is a public health success, Charles said. It's important for everyone to get them so the public can develop what's called a 'herd immunity.'
But when parents choose not to vaccinate, they put others at risk, Charles said. 'They are dumping on the community to protect their child.'"
Seems Dr. Charles needs to figure out which side of the fence she is standing on.
Either vaccines promote herd immunity, which works to ensure that children & others who are unvaccinated do not pose a threat to the vaccinated masses; or herd immunity does not exist, which means that the unvaccinated do pose a threat.
May 18, 2009 at 8 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Two_Sheds (anonymous) says...
Dr. Charles is a brilliant doctor. My Asperger's son has been a patient of hers for years, and she is one of the smartest women I know when it comes to developmental pediatrics and autism.
Her reasoning is sound: herd immunity would work just fine in communities in which the population remains stable, and in which most of the people have immunity to certain diseases. But Charleston's community is in a constant state of flux, with people coming from all parts of the country and the world; this introduces communities to new or different pathogens for which we don't have a naturally acquired immunity (swine flu, anyone?).
Even if someone has been vaccinated against a disease, or if they have acquired an immunity to it, that person can still (in rare cases) get the disease again. It is not unheard of for someone who has had chicken pox to either get it again, or to develop a different form of the disease, such as shingles. This is why the unvaccinated people pose a threat--they can reintroduce diseases to community members who were otherwise already thought to be immune.
May 18, 2009 at 8:52 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
majorjohnson (anonymous) says...
I agree with collette. If the majority have the vaccines and are protected why does it matter if a few get the flu or mumps? What's more, I believe our over sterilized and air conditioned lives have increased problems like asthma and reduced immunities. People become resistant to problem bacteria by being exposed to them. Swimming in sewage is not necessarily a good idea, but neither is cleaning your house with bacteria killer floor to ceiling and keeping it shut closed with the a/c or heater running year round.
May 18, 2009 at 8:53 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Two_Sheds (anonymous) says...
Some diseases are just plain difficult to immunize against, because the bacteria or viruses can mutate so quickly, making an immunization pointless. Within the first year that penicillin was mass-marketed in the 40s, the first strain of penicillin-resistant bacteria had already developed.
May 18, 2009 at 8:58 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
SCdeacinNYC (anonymous) says...
I don't know why people are still on this supposed link between vaccines and autism, it's been debunked many times. It also wouldn't be getting as much attention if people like that Jenny McCarthy and Jim Carrey weren't all over the places claiming that this were the case with no scientific evidence on their side. Don't get me wrong, I understand the parents. When something this serious is wrong with your child it's much easier to look for something tangible to blame rather than accept that there is no rhyme or reason behind a lot of these disorders. No one knows what causes autism.
I think that the spectrum for the disease is much wider now than it was 10 years ago so of course there is much more diagnosis, which may not necessarily mean that there are more and more kids developing it. I also think vaccine injury is a real thing, but it's true that some kids have developed autism-like symptoms and not actually have the disease.
major I agree with the over-sterilization of this country in particular. I don't think there is anything wrong with vaccines. Some thing need vaccines like some forms of the measles, small pox, meningitis...etc. But our country's obsession with anti-bacterial everything and antibiotics are killing our natural immune systems. Doctors have been saying for years that parents that obsess about anti bacterial soaps and hand sanitizers are killing the good bacteria in our bodies. I also think it's making our kids into a bunch of weaklings. Doctors also at fault as well because they want to give you antibiotics for everything! It's ridiculous. I have a cold, not a serious infection, why do I need antibiotics for that. I also don't think people of a certain age group should get the flu shot. I'm in my twenties. I should have a healthy immune system. If I get the flu, I'll get sick and my body will get over it. End of story, why should I get the flu shot for as a healthy twenty-something. It makes no sense to me.
May 18, 2009 at 9:46 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
beefsaver (anonymous) says...
The problem with herd immunity is that, like "Two Sheds" said, is the adaptability of the threat and the flux of the herd. For some people, the vaccine just works, and thus they're not going to harbor, transmit, or succumb to an infection. For others, the vaccine works to inhibit the hosting and transmission, but if a more virulent strain (carried by a new, unvaccinated member of the group) is introduced, they can catch it.
The article says it all: there is no link. Thimerosol (the dreaded mercury-based component) was removed years ago, and no measurable drop in Autism spectrum cases was noted. In fact, as the umbrella of that spectrum broadens and is getting better-understood, diagnoses are rising.
Anyone that questions the need for a robust vaccination program has merely forgotten the immense and awful impact of past killers such as polio. Because of this hysteria, diseases once thought eradicated are coming back in pockets. Congratulations, fear-addled parents: you've done nothing to stop autism but plenty to aid other diseases.
May 18, 2009 at 9:53 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
WhatMeWorry (anonymous) says...
SCdeacinNYC and beefsaver, your posts are right on. The only thing I would argue with, SCdeacinNYC, is that doctors want to give antibiotics inappropriately.
I think most doctors would be thrilled if a patient with cough and cold symptoms came and said, "I've been having these symptoms and I want to make sure it's nothing serious. If it's just a cold, I'll just let it run it's course."
Unfortunately, most patients go to the doctor with the expectation that they will walk out with a quick fix. Doctors feel tremendous pressure to provide good "customer service" rather than good "patient care."
Are the doctors who give in to this pressure at fault? Yes, but I would not go so far as to say that they "want to give antibiotics."
May 18, 2009 at 10:04 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Maggy (anonymous) says...
Autism is simply a term from the psychiatric DSM-IV manual. It's nothing but a smokescreen. It provides an alibi for the drug companies who added mercury to vaccines at levels 250 times higher than hazardous waste levels (based on toxicity characteristics). It provides an alibi for the CDC, FDA, the American Academy of Pediatrics and the other drug company cronies who are responsible for the safety of our children. It provides an alibi for the pediatricians who administered this poison. It provides an alibi for health insurance companies so they don't have to pay for treatment for these sick kids. It provides an alibi for psychiatrists so they can force powerfull anti-psychotic drugs on these kids who are already terribly confused.
There will never be an identifiable cause for autism. There are though 12 published papers which identify the underlying medical condition of autism as neuroinflammatory disease. My favorite is " Neuroglial activation and Neuroinflammation in the Brain of Patients with Autism". This was published by John Hopkins University. Now, do you want to debate whether mercury, a known neurotoxin, added to childhood vaccines at levels 250 times higher than what the EPA identifies as hazardous waste, causes neuroinflammatory disease? Do you want to debate whether brain damaged kids behave in a way so that some psychiatrist can label them as somewhere on the "spectrum"?
May 18, 2009 at 10:13 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Maggy (anonymous) says...
The science Dr. Offit refers to is not science at all. It's nothing more than statistical manipulation done by people affiliated with the mandatory vaccine program. If you want to learn about this sceudo science go here; http://fourteenstudies.org/index.html
May 18, 2009 at 10:19 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
coolfreaknbeans (anonymous) says...
SCdeacinNYC you hit the nail on the head. Like when Jenny McCarthy said her son was "cured" of autism. She claimed diet "cured" him. Boy that pissed a lot of people off. I can't stand these celebrities with no education spouting off crap.
May 18, 2009 at 10:23 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
LadyTarHeel (anonymous) says...
Interesting article. There is no scientific link between vaccines and autism. I think that the increase in the diagnosis of autism is correlated with improvements in the health care system. Doctors know what to look for. I don't think cleaning your house with anti-bacterial cleaners would change anything. Things that kill 99.9% of bacteria only reduce the bacterial content by 1 log unit. Meaning if you have 1x10^5 bacteria before, you will have 1x10^4 bacteria afterward. This is why there is an asterisk beside that information on the label.
May 18, 2009 at 10:26 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
SCdeacinNYC (anonymous) says...
whatmeworry, I was speaking from my own personal experience. Granted I live in NYC, home of all things neurotic and ridiculous when it comes to health. Everyone here is way over-medicated. I just had a cold last month and I got checked out and my doctor immediately prescribed antibiotics. I didn't take them. It was a simple cold, it was gone it two days. Don't even get me started on them prescribing me vicodin after a root canal. It's just overkill. I do realize the patients fuel this as well, but it seems the doctors are sometimes complicit also.
Maggy, I'm sorry but are you trying to claim that the CDC, FDA and AAP are all in cahoots in some giant conspiracy with the drug companies to poison our kids. Sorry, that's a little too far-fetched and paranoid, even for me, and I love a good conspiracy theory. What mercury are you referring to? As many people have already said
Thimerosal was removed several years ago. You say in your second paragraph that there will never be an identifiable cause for autism but in the first paragraph you try to claim that vaccines are the problem and that basically every major medical institution in this country is at fault.
Most evidence point to genetic causes. I've also read that boys are four times as likely to be diagnoses than girls. Some of these kids aren't "brain damaged" some probably have some disorder, possibly genetic, and ended up on the bad end of the genetic roulette wheel. My friend is a genetic counselor and she sees it all the time, and hopefully someday we might be able to know what causes it but that still won't lead us to be able to prevent it. Look at all the other genetic diseases out there that aren't preventable. It seems like you got your fearmongering directly from one of these anti-vaccine sites that are still propagating false science. In order for you to be right, all these organizations and even individual doctors have to be a part of probably the biggest government conspiracy since what we saw on the X-Files. Thing about that for a second.
May 18, 2009 at 10:30 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
SCdeacinNYC (anonymous) says...
Thing=think. Sorry it's still early.
coolfreak, I was also pissed at Oprah for having her on there with that nonsense. I think it was completely irresponsible. Of course if you listen to a C-list celebrity and make health decisions based on that, well you are a fool also. But people actually do watch and listen to what Oprah says for some reason and I think she should have had actual scientists on to refute some of the crap she said that day.
May 18, 2009 at 10:33 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
WhatMeWorry (anonymous) says...
Oh, Maggy, I would definitely take the bet that within 20 years, we'll have an identifiable cause for autism. And that's because there are a lot of dedicated, hard-working, caring doctors and scientists working on it.
The authors of the study you referred to concluded that, "innate neuroimmune reactions play a pathogenic role in an undefined proportion of autistic patients, suggesting that future therapies might involve modifying neuroglial responses in the brain."
That is what we call a scientific conclusion based on research findings. You are jumping to the conclusion that mercury is responsible for those inflammatory changes when it could be a million other triggers. Mercury MAY be able to cause inflammatory changes but that doesn't mean that it DOES. That's the difference between a scientific, rational conclusion and one born out of fear, ignorance, and frustration.
Oh, and one other thing, Maggy, the EPA's guidelines for mercury to which you refer are for methyl mercury, not ethyl mercury, en entirely different compound with different properties.
Your kind of ignorant propaganda is dangerous. You and Jenny McCarthy should stick to watching old Remote Control episodes to keep within your intellectual boundaries.
May 18, 2009 at 10:33 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Maggy (anonymous) says...
Here's some straight forward facts;
0.5 parts per billion (ppb) mercury = Kills human neuroblastoma cells (Parran et al., Toxicol Sci 2005; 86: 132-140).
2 ppb mercury = U.S. EPA limit for drinking water (http://www.epa. gov/safewater/ contaminants/ index.html# mcls).
20 ppb mercury = Neurite membrane structure destroyed (Leong et al., Neuroreport 2001; 12: 733-37).
200 ppb mercury = level in liquid the EPA classifies as hazardous waste based on toxicity characteristics.
http://www.epa.gov/epawaste/hazard/ts...
25,000 ppb mercury = Concentration of mercury in multi-dose, Hepatitis B vaccine vials, administered at birth from 1991-2001 in the U.S.
50,000 ppb mercury = Concentration of mercury in multi-dose DTaP and Haemophilus B vaccine vials, administered 8 times in the 1990's to children at 2, 4, 6, 12 and 18 months of age and currently "preservative" level mercury in multi-dose flu, meningococcal and tetanus vaccines. This can be confirmed by simply analyzing the multi-dose vials. Flu, meningococcal and tetanus vaccines are all approved for use in children. The claim mercury is out of vaccines is bogus.
May 18, 2009 at 11:33 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Maggy (anonymous) says...
Whatmeworry, you're right, ethyl and methyl mercury are different but also similiar in some ways. Both are short chain alkyl mercury compounds, the most toxic form of mercury. Both are immediatley distributed to the brain. The difference is that the ethylmercury bond is less stable than the methlymercury bond. That means ethyl rapidilly converts to Hg++ in the brain where it remains permanently trapped. This form of mercury in the brain has been linked to degenerative brain disease. Direct intramuscular injection of mercury is much more toxic than ingestion of mercury via food. Mercury in fish is also tightly bound to protein so it is only partially absorbed through the gut. The mainstream doctors don't have a clue about mercury toxicity. Ever see any toxicologists involved with these vaccine safety studies? Also, aren't newborns more suscepteble to mercury than adults?
May 18, 2009 at 11:48 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
ffwife (anonymous) says...
Didn't I hear that a pregnant woman can have a certain test during pregnancy to find out if the baby has autism - or a few other disorders? If this is so, then is the parents vaccine the one causing the problem. Because obviously the unborn child has not be given any type of vaccine.
Maybe I've got my disorders mixed up and it's not autism they test for. Does anyone know?
May 18, 2009 at 12:12 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
SCdeacinNYC (anonymous) says...
ffwife, you might be referring to another disorder. Kids are tyically to young to show signs of autism up until a certain age (which is why a lot of people have claimed this vaccine link). There is no prenatal test for autism. Pregnant women can have genetic tests for a lot of other disorders though. Down's Syndrome, Sickle Cell...et cetera. I definitely recommend parents go to a genetic counselor even before they decide to have children so they at least know what they may be up against and definitely when pregnant.
May 18, 2009 at 12:21 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
ffwife (anonymous) says...
Thanks, NYC.
I think I do remember, now, that is was Down's Syndrome I had heard could be tested for. Thanks again.
May 18, 2009 at 12:41 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Sark (anonymous) says...
Quick Maggy, get your tinfoil hat back on! And watch out for those Russians, they're after our precious bodily fluids again!
"I believe our over sterilized and air conditioned lives have increased problems like asthma and reduced immunities."
Not to be rude, but when it comes to science/medicine no one gives a [expletive deleted] what you "believe". It comes down to what you can prove in an empirical, scientific way. Maybe you're right on this, I don't know, I'm not a doctor, but when people say "I believe...." I imediatly tune out. You'll never hear a doctor say "I believe penicillin is effective."
May 18, 2009 at 1:16 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
WhatMeWorry (anonymous) says...
Maggy, your comments expose you as a quasi-educated crackpot with an agenda. Beware - you are arguing with someone with an intense scientific background who has researched this thoroughly because of my own two children. So if you are going to bring it, bring it correct.
The first error that mortally hurts your entire argument is that there has been no decrease in autism since thimerisol (which contains ethyl mercury) has been removed from vaccines.
I could stop there. Yet I feel compelled to correct your other mistakes.
Next, saying that ethyl- and methyl-mercury are "different but also similiar in some ways" is like saying oxygen and cyanide are "different but also similiar in some ways." Their chemical properties in both a test tube and in mammal metabolism are quite different.
Next, ethyl mercury does not "rapidilly converts to Hg++ in the brain where it remains permanently trapped." It leaves the tissues. All tissues.
Next, toxicologists are often co-investigators is these studies. Look at "authors' affiliations" in the papers.
All of these points are not things that "I believe." They can be verified. All you have to do is have access to PubMed or MedLine and search. Then you can stop "believing" and start knowing.
Lastly, I agree fully that we do not know what causes autism. I also do not "know" that mercury or vaccines are not at all involved. What I do know is that it has been extensively studied and all the evidence strongly suggests that mercury, thimerisol, and vaccines are not associated with autism.
A smart, rational approach would be to focus on finding out what DOES cause autism rather that continue beating the one dead horse that's been thoroughly investigated.
May 18, 2009 at 1:52 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Maggy (anonymous) says...
Whatmeworry, Temper, Temper.......
"The first error that mortally hurts your entire argument is that there has been no decrease in autism since thimerisol (which contains ethyl mercury) has been removed from vaccines."
First of all learn how to spell thimerosal. I've already explained to you that 3 vaccines still contain the full amount of mercury. Also, one day you say mercury is out of vaccines (it isn't) and the rates keep going up. The next day you say rates havn't increased at all, its just better diagnosis. You can't have it both ways!
"Next, ethyl mercury does not "rapidilly converts to Hg++ in the brain where it remains permanently trapped." It leaves the tissues. All tissues."
Read this paper Mr. Scientist. It clearly states that the primates exposed to thimerosal retain twice as much Hg++ in the brain as the methylmercury exposed group.
"Burbacher T, Shen D, Liberato N, Grant K, Cernichiari E, Clarkson T. 2005. Comparison of blood and brain mercury levels in infant monkeys exposed to methylmercury or vaccines containing thimerosal. Environmental Health Perspectives. 113:1015-1021"
"Next, toxicologists are often co-investigators is these studies. Look at "authors' affiliations" in the papers."
Early Thimerosal Exposure and Neuropsychological Outcomes New England Journal of Medicine, Thompson WW et al. (September 27, 2007)
Conflicts statement from the study:
"Dr. Thompson reports being a former employee of Merck; Dr. Marcy, receiving consulting fees from Merck, Sanofi Pasteur, GlaxoSmithKline, and MedImmune; Dr. Jackson, receiving grant support from Wyeth, Sanofi Pasteur, GlaxoSmithKline, and Novartis, lecture fees from Sanofi Pasteur, and consulting fees from Wyeth and Abbott and serving as a consultant to the FDA Vaccines and Related Biological Products Advisory Committee; Dr. Lieu, serving as a consultant to the CDC Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices; Dr. Black, receiving consulting fees from MedImmune, GlaxoSmithKline, Novartis, and Merck and grant support from MedImmune, GlaxoSmithKline, Aventis, Merck, and Novartis; and Dr. Davis receiving consulting fees from Merck and grant support from Merck and GlaxoSmith- Kline. No other potential conflict of interest relevant to this article was reported."
Which one is the toxicologist? Would it have been easier to mention the authors that don't have a conflict of interest?
May 18, 2009 at 2:37 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
WhatMeWorry (anonymous) says...
Maggy, I'll go point by point:
1) "temper, temper" There's no anger here. Just trying to educate.
2) "First of all learn how to spell thimerosal." My bad. But if you must bring up insignificant spelling errors,
3) "The next day you say rates havn't increased at all." See if you can spot the error.
4) "you say mercury is out of vaccines (it isn't)" Technically, you are correct. However, mercury is out of all vaccines that infants receive. It remains in measurable amounts in some vaccines that older folks get. (source: http://www.vaccinesafety.edu/thi-tabl...)
5) "Read this paper Mr. Scientist. It clearly states that the primates exposed to thimerosal retain twice as much Hg++ in the brain as the methylmercury exposed group." Hmm... you'd better reread that one. Here's a direct quote from that paper: "Brain concentrations of total Hg were significantly lower by approximately 3-fold for the thimerosal-exposed monkeys when compared with the MeHg infants." Again, try reading the words without injecting your agenda.
6) Showing an example of one paper in which the authors have financial links to drug companies is easy. Now try the rational approach and see how many papers you can find in which the authors don't have financial links to industry and read their conclusion. I won't give away the answer, but I'll give you a hint: there are a lot of good scientists out there in search of the truth for the betterment of their children and mankind.
There is no question that industry's involvement in research taints the results. However, the majority of research that is done has nothing to do with drug companies and gets no funding from them.
May 18, 2009 at 2:58 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
my2centsworth (anonymous) says...
My concern is that as a child I was vaccinated. When I had a daughter, she was vaccinated. Her daughter has been vaccinated... And the purpose of these vaccines are to establish anti-bodies in our systems to fight these diseases, which means they are, from the point of vaccination, a part of us. The mother's immunity transfers to the newborn through her milk, and are good, supposedly for about 6 months. I would suppose that the mother might also transfer these vaccines to the newborn, too- or they are at least traveling through the child's bloodstream in utero. When the child is born, we load him or her up with another dose, on top of what the mother already carries in her blood... It just seems to make sense to start seriously questioning these vacines because Autism has definitely started becoming more prevalent with this 3rd generation of mothers... Something is causing this and I don't think it is anything -near- a natural cause.
And this anti-bacterial -everything- is a detriment to our natural immunity that we -need- to fight off the influx of ever new and developing problems... I grew up washing with Ivory soap, eating dirt, methiolate on scrapes and occasionally a band-aid.... I lived!
May 18, 2009 at 3:26 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Maggy (anonymous) says...
Whatmeworry. Glad you're not mad. I'll knock off the spelling critiques. I just reread the Burbacher paper per your suggestion. Here is what I found;
"There was a much higher proportion of inorganic Hg (Hg++) in the brain of thimerosal monkeys than in the brains of MeHg monkeys (up to 71% vs. 10%). Absolute inorganic Hg concentrations in the brains of the thimerosal-exposed monkeys were approximately twice that of the MeHg monkeys. Interestingly, the inorganic fraction in the kidneys of the same cohort of monkeys was also significantly higher after inj thimerosal than after oral MeHg exposure (0.71 ± 0.04 vs. 0.40 ± 0.03). This suggests that the dealkylation of ethylmercury is much more extensive than that of MeHg."
Seems pretty staight forward. No better model than primates, right? One more point I'd like to make, methylmercury can exit the brain just as easy as it enters the brain. This is not the case with the inorganic fraction.
May 18, 2009 at 3:30 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
newbattleaxe (anonymous) says...
Something that has been hardly mentioned in all this debate is the very high number of Baby Boomers who were slathered with merchurochrome and merthiolate for the tiniest of scratches, and who played with the mercury from broken thermometers regularly.
Boomers were also subjected to thimerosal-laced vaccinations with great regularity. Many Lowcountry residents remember yearly tetanus and typhoid vaccinations in the '50's and '60's.
So, if any age group should have a high incidence of autism, it should be the Baby Boomers. Where, then, are the data to support this? Where are the research papers?
May 18, 2009 at 6:10 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Sark (anonymous) says...
"Autism has definitely started becoming more prevalent with this 3rd generation of mothers... Something is causing this and I don't think it is anything -near- a natural cause."
Has it? I know more people have been diagnosed with autism. Does that automatically mean "more people have autism"? It seems at least equally likely that autism rates have been steady, and more people are simply being diagnosed.
May 18, 2009 at 7:50 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
cinnabar (anonymous) says...
Maggy, what is the Hg concentration in a human child with 1 liter of blood when vaccinated with a 25 ppm Hg spiked vaccine?
1 cc would contain 1g/1,000,000 * 25 = 0.000025 g Hg. dilute this in 1 liter of blood (1000 cc, appx 1 kg) and you get 0.025 ppb in the bloodstream, well below your published limits. In a 0.5 liter bloodstream you get 0.05 ppb. 10 ccs would give you 0.5....Is that correct?
What doseage is appropriate for a child?
May 18, 2009 at 8:01 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
clc13 (anonymous) says...
I read about a study that found that there are children who have never been vaccinated and have been diagnosed with autism. If vaccines are the cause of autism, how did these children acquire it?
May 18, 2009 at 8:55 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Maggy (anonymous) says...
Cinnabar, it's not that complicated. Vaccines are preserved with mercury at a concentration of 50 ug/ml or 50,000 ug/liter (ppb). A 0.5 ml dose is 25 ug., 25 ug/0.5 liter of blood is 50 ppb. 25 ug/per 0.3 liter of blood (more realistic for a 2 month baby) is 83 ppb. 62.5 ug Hg (Hep. B, HIB, DTaP) at 2 months would be 208 ppb.
May 19, 2009 at 9:26 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
cinnabar (anonymous) says...
Maggy, i think you mean ...vaccines 'were' preserved...
May 19, 2009 at 9:14 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
cinnabar (anonymous) says...
Maggy, your math is wrong. 25ug injected into 0.5 liter blood (1/2 liter, 500 grams) = 0.000025/500 = 0.00000005 g or 0.05 ug/l. Remember, 1 liter = 1000 g. 1 mg = 0.001g; 1 ug = 0.000001g; 25 ug = 0.000025g...
0.300 ml blood injected with 25ug in vaccine = 0.00000008 0r 0.08ug/l, which is below your warning limits on your post...
May 19, 2009 at 9:31 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
cinnabar (anonymous) says...
The mercury in vaccine was added after several childern died from infection from vaccine when first placed on the market. The mercury additive fixed this problem. You probably agree it's not good to inject bacteria laced vaccine directly into a child's bloodstream.
Taking Hg out could possibly allow some strains of 'super resistant' bacteria at some point to take several more lives and the history will be repeated before the cause is discovered.
I pray this doesn't happen...especially when some crusaders have based such a decision on poor and incomplete science...
May 19, 2009 at 9:40 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
HopeForAutism (anonymous) says...
Have you ever heard the saying, "You don't know what you don't know"? As I read through the comments here, this is truly the case for most who write. Anyone who would have come to hear the information presented would have seen for themselves. The pro-vaccine movement has the same worn-out rhetoric, which is viewed in a totally different light for people who are willing to open their mind to truthful, unbiased information. All the inaccuracies that people hear, "mercury removed", "vaccines have been studied", "autism is genetic" have been circulated by those who profit. For all those confused out there, consider these facts... mercury HAS NOT been removed from vaccines. Flu and other still have the FULL dose (and yes, infants DO get this shot), others have "trace" amounts. The value of "trace" was determined by the pharmaceutical company, Eli Lilly, and still far exceeds safety levels according to even their own studies. Vaccines have NOT been proven to not cause autism. One vaccine, MMR, and ONE ingredient, thimerosal, have been studied. There are 35 vaccines and thousands of ingredients that HAVE NOT been studied (aluminum, phenol, formaldehyde, acetone, glycerin...). Anyone who says that we have proven that vaccines are not related to autism have either never read the studies or is dishonest. See www.fourteenstudies.org . Someone mentions topical mercury used in the sixties... ummmm... mercury INJECTED is totally different than mercury consumed or used topically. And topical forms were pulled off the market. Yes, there have been cases of autism in persons unvaccinated... very rare. No one claims vaccines are the only cause. But consider this: the EPA estimates that 1 in 6 children (630,000 per yr) are born in US with unsafe blood levels of mercury at birth (Mahaffey 2004). Mothers are getting flu shots, Rhogam shots, other vaccines, amalgam fillings, and we WONDER why children are born showing signs of autism? If autism has remained steady, where are the 1.3 million undiagnosed adults we are missing? And in reference to WhatMeWorry's comment "... the majority of research that is done has nothing to do with drug companies and gets no funding from them." what planet are you from??? Again, go to www.fourteenstudies.org and see for yourself. So much mis-information, so much ignorance. I'm not to be offensive, but I'm offended that people are hurting their children and refuse to take a closer look... to be continued
May 19, 2009 at 9:59 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
HopeForAutism (anonymous) says...
Coming soon in Charleston we will be offering a pediatric neurological exam that documents microvascular ischemia post-vaccine. If your child has been vaccine-injured, contact mary@marytocco.com . Too bad that the doctors here that are so-called "specialists" did not attend to see the science. We challenge all to come forth and look at the evidence that is coming out... it's only a matter of time. Another conference is coming November 6-8, 2009. But don't wait until then, children will be injured in the interim. We are waging a war against IGNORANCE!
Submitted in honesty and integrity,
Dr. Renee Tocco
Founder of Hope For Autism and the American Chiropractic Autism Board
May 19, 2009 at 10 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Sark (anonymous) says...
Anyone think that "Event highlights scientific illiteracy" would have been just as accurate a title?
May 19, 2009 at 11:07 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
KelliAnnDavis (anonymous) says...
But when parents choose not to vaccinate, they put others at risk, Charles said. "They are dumping on the community to protect their child."
Doctor, making the best medical decision for MY child based on safety issues is not "dumping on the community".
The fact of the matter is the FULL vaccine schedule has NEVER been tested in totality and studied for long-term health effects -- ever.
Don't believe me? Go read a current insert from one of the major manufacturers which state in black and white that the studies haven't been done (and which medical authorities like yourself fail to relay to the public) and then let's discuss WHO is the irresponsible party here!
Bottom Line: Sacrificing a child for the "herd" is all good and dandy until it's YOUR OWN child who's at the alter. So please, get a grip and stop dictating to parents how they should make medical decisions for their children when issues of safety are at stake.
Last I checked, this is STILL the "land of the FREE and brave."
Kelli Ann Davis
DC Political Liaison
Generation Rescue
May 20, 2009 at 12:59 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
ltgrunt (anonymous) says...
KelliAnnDavis and HopeForAutism, you both seem to have been duped by what is now and old and proven falsehood. No scientific evidence exists to support any causal link between Autism and immunizations - researchers who are still grasping at that concept are just looking for fame and recognition, much the same as the doctor who first made the claim with falsified documentation.
I'll give you points for trying to be diligent, but you're wasting effort by vilifying a safe and proven procedure that has no impact on Autism. Instead of continuing to bark up the wrong trees, it would probably be best to put your time, effort and money into new research with probable and logical hypotheses.
Even the American Medical Association has called chiropractic medicine an unscientific cult, and the most favorable consideration for it is alternative medicine. Pseudo-medicine isn't really the best basis from which to be conducting research or making statements about vaccinations or Autism, let alone the fictional relationship between the two.
And sure, it's all well and good to be an activist and talk about how we should all be free to do whatever we want, but when it comes to making medical decisions about our children, it's important to make those free choices with *sound and reputable* medical information, not sensationalist misinformation.
May 20, 2009 at 2:16 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
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