Sanford to accept most of funding
Governor holding firm in rebuffing $700M
By Yvonne Wenger
COLUMBIA — Gov. Mark Sanford will send a letter to the White House today agreeing to accept the bulk of nearly $8 billion in federal stimulus money for South Carolina, but he is still holding out against accepting $700 million that would primarily go to public schools.
Brett Flashnick/AP
State Sen. Tom Davis (left), the former chief of staff for Gov. Mark Sanford (right), said Thursday that there still is two years for Sanford to request the $700 million in federal stimulus funds, most of which will go to the state's schools.
White House officials confirmed for the first time Thursday that the 45-day deadline that ends at midnight tonight applies only to governors' initial requests for the money, not to states' formal application for it.
If his letter meets the Obama administration's muster, there would be more time — as much as four months — to ask for the funds. If the letter doesn't get it right, and with deadline so close, the state could lose that portion for good.
South Carolina remained the only state that had not requested the money as of Thursday, as acrimony and confusion continued to dominate the Statehouse over what will happen next.
The $700 million, a portion of the estimated total South Carolina could get in the $787 billion American Recovery and Reinvestment Act, has been the center of a feud between Sanford and the Legislature for weeks.
Sanford, an unyielding opponent of the stimulus package, has taken the position that the $700 million is the only portion of the money that he has the power to reject.
Congress intended that portion of the stimulus money to be used as budget aid to carry South Carolina through the recession, and about 82 percent of it is designated for schools.
The responses
House Speaker Bobby Harrell's response to Sanford's comments at Thursday's press conference. (Word doc)
Sen. Hugh Leatherman's response to Sanford's comments at Thursday's press conference. (Word doc
It is unclear what will happen from here.
If Sanford continues to reject the $700 million, U.S. House Majority Whip Jim Clyburn, D-S.C., may try to persuade Congress to circumvent Sanford by depositing the money in South Carolina coffers before it would be diverted to other states.
Either way, taxpayers here will be paying it back because it was borrowed by the federal government, and the country as a whole is on the hook.
The U.S. Office of Management and Budget said a certification letter sent by midnight will satisfy the first
step in receiving stimulus money. Sanford would need to submit an application at a later date to draw down the $700 million in budget aid.
Sanford press secretary Joel Sawyer said late Thursday that the governor plans to sign a letter to accept the money that, according to the governor's office, he is not able to control.
Interactive map
A map from Recovery.gov showing which states have and have not certified the stimulus money.
But the governor is refusing to sign off on the $700 million that is under his direct control, unless the Legislature uses an equal amount of state money to pay down debt. Sawyer said Sanford will still have time to apply for that portion of the money later.
Legislative leadership argues that there is not enough money to keep teachers in the classroom and law enforcement on the streets, much less to pay down debt. If the governor is right, there will still be time for a compromise with legislators. If he is wrong, it will be up to Congress to send the money here or let it go to other states.
On Thursday, Sanford, joined by a handful of state senators, spoke out against the chief legislative budget writer, Sen. Hugh Leatherman.
The governor said the Florence Republican purposely left $587 million out of early budgeting scenarios as a way to make it look like the state was in dire straits without the $700 million in budget aid.
Related stories
Sanford may cost local schools $18M, published 4/3/2009
SLED director urges S.C. to accept $700M, published 4/3/2009
"It's important as we go through the budget-setting process that we not ... scare people as a way of strengthening one's political hand," Sanford said.
Without the $700 million, Leatherman and his Senate colleagues said the state could lose at least 3,000 schoolteachers and hundreds of law enforcement officers and state employees.
In response to the potential consequences of drawing a budget without the $700 million, hundreds came to the Statehouse Wednesday to protest the governor and call on him to take the money.
Leatherman said it is true that the budget scenarios so far have not included the $587 million from a pot of money that is dependent on other stimulus cash, but the Senate has not yet finished drafting its budget proposal.
"If you've really got yourself in a box, and some say the governor has himself in a box, maybe one way out is to start diverting attention," Leatherman said. "The thing I've noticed of our governor over the years is, he loves to play the blame game, not his fault, always someone else's fault."
Sen. Tom Davis, a Beaufort Republican and Sanford's former chief of staff, claimed that there is still time, in fact two years worth of time, for Sanford to take the money in question.
U.S. Secretary of Education Arne Duncan said this week that he hopes to work with Congress on legislation that would send the money to South Carolina. A spokeswoman for Clyburn said he is working with Duncan to find a solution.
U.S. Sen. Lindsey Graham, R-S.C., said he doubts it is possible. U.S. Rep. Henry Brown, a Republican whose 1st Congressional district covers most of the Lowcountry, declined to comment.
The Associated Press and McClatchy Newspapers contributed to this report.
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Comments
charlestt (anonymous) says...
Mark Sanford is a hero! Lethermann is a redneck idiot with the accumen of tabacco spit. He is typical of the politicians around our State, they treat us like mushrooms, feed us crap and keep us in the dark. We do not need this money, we need to tighten our belt, fire a good many State employee's and cut unemployment benefits. We should eliminate bussing all the little crumb snatchers from one side of town to the other and shift the responsibility to the parent where it really lays. How much do we spend on bussing? How much do we spend on free and reduced lunches for children who's momma already be gettin food stamps. How many fat women in house slippers are going to drop off their urine drenched child at my wife's school? Get mad at the freeloaders of our State not Sanford! Your Statehouse is laughing at how pliable you are, they have done damage that is incomprehensible to most citizens. If you don't see the problem, your are part of it. Really!
Also, if you think a new credit card would be great right now and help you "get caught up", then you are the person(s) I am talking to.
Blue eyes, we are in the 21st century despite your comment yesterday. Read what you wrote about get rid of these voters etc. etc. If conservatives talked to you that way it would sound something like this: Never forget where you are, this is our country and you are basically just a visitor. Be aware, the vast majority of the populus are people with means and conviction. The media has only created an illusion that you are many, you are not. History, in fact, does cycle and progressive movements always get "slapped down hard" as you put it. All the things you love about this country, came from the HARD WORK of honorable people, not from people who were willing to stand in line for a check from the government. What has held us together is not a hollow check but a love of country and a DUTY to serve her, not rape her for a little bit of $$. Can't those of you oppossed to Sanfords actions see that?
April 3, 2009 at 3:48 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
proud2bme (anonymous) says...
Way to go Sanford and kudos to you charlestt!!!
April 3, 2009 at 4:31 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
moonpie (anonymous) says...
Told you so.... I keep posting.
April 3, 2009 at 6:08 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
justmyview (anonymous) says...
It is absolutely amazing that Sanford managed to stay in the news this long over this issue. He can't gather any media attention for being a governor who has failed to provide any leadership or ideas for bring South Carolina out of the basement in education and attracting new industries to the state. Sanford's appeal is largely to the extreme elements of the republican party who dismiss pragmaticism for ideology.
April 3, 2009 at 6:19 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
lloyd007 (anonymous) says...
Good Lord..Looking at some of the Postings thus far,leads one to believe that folks of this want to be "plantation" state need to grow a BRAIN.Does your wife really Teach?,Oh my GOD!!.Then it is no wonder the state's Education problems is what it is..Your constant stance of "Country and Duty", simply shows what really exists, a bunch of insecure yahoos sitting around waving a confederate flag calling yourself AMERICANS when in actuality your actions are Treasonous at best.South Carolina is not an Island unto itself (Ask your wife,SHE TEACHES'),as long as the divide is there,the state will never prosper to it's full potential....EDUCATE YOUR CITIZENRY...Why should the hard earned money of the people of this state(S.C.) go to uplift other states and the people of South Carolina will still be paying the money back...HELLO..Are you not tired of being sick and tired?
Are you not tired of being at the bottom of the barrel? Good Lord...GROW A BRAIN!!!!
April 3, 2009 at 6:25 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
northeastguy (anonymous) says...
The King of clowns continues to search for the headlines. Problem is, the headline is "Mark, You're A Political Clown" and America Laughs at you!
April 3, 2009 at 6:36 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Get_seriousHELP (anonymous) says...
northeastguy - Not the King of Clowns, that belongs to obama, but he is your clown because he caved in and sold out.
The circus is in DC and all you idiots that want this non-money - DEBT - for future generations of Americans, you idoits that support this are the mini-clowns riding their little cycles in the little tent as a side show.
What kind of self-serving scum want to saddle the their children with this massive debt?
Let us all bow now to the Chinese and thank them for loaning us this 'money'.
Printing money doesnt work, when it is as worthless as toilet paper, and just like the simpletons that support taking other peoples money, it wont be good for anything more than what TP is used for.
April 3, 2009 at 6:52 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
gringo59 (anonymous) says...
Charlestt --
Do your homework. What would SC be if it were not for stimulus $$$ from the New Deal following the last great depression. Roosevelt and federal efforts saved thousands in this state from starvation and put the state and country back to work. My wife also teaches in the public school system in one of the most underfunded under-taxed states in the Union, SC. The real problem here is not our current governor, although he governs like a moron. The real problem is the selfish nature of our citizenry who do not want to pay the bill for educating our children, a basic RIGHT to which every child is entitled ("urine drenched" or not). As our citizenry becomes better educated, to borrow a phrase from Reagen, all cultural and intellectual boats rise with the educational tide. Unfortunately, it's perpetual low tide in SC.
April 3, 2009 at 7 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
AMAZING (anonymous) says...
Do we have a new governor? Tom "goon" Davis. Really?
What is Tom "goon" Davis doing? What about his twin brother Sanfraud.
What the "Goon" and the "Fraud" are doing is that they are attempting to cheat South Carolina taxpayers out of their own money. It's a big shell game and in a shell game you lose. They want everyone so confused that in the end no one will be able to figure out where the money went, just like a shell game. Where did the money go? Pay down debt? Really? This is no different than when Thomas Ravenel wanted to put the State's Treasury monies in Commodities, Hedges Funds, and the Stock Market. If Ravenel would have had his way, the taxpayers would have never seen that money again, POOF!, it's gone. This is no different.
Watch Sanfraud's slight of hand. Listen to all of the diversions and distractions from the twins. Why are they burning the midnight oil to confuse you? Simple, so that people are so upside down that they don't have a clue as to where there money is going. One thing we know for sure, Sanfraud is starving SLED, Department of Public Safety, Department of Corrections, Department of Education, on and on. Where is all of our money going? Sanfraud's shell game seems to work very well. POOF! The monies are gone. NEXT!
Follow the money. Sanfraud and his little brother "goon" should be investigated by the Feds. They are an absolute disgrace to the State of South Carolina.
April 3, 2009 at 7:01 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Get_seriousHELP (anonymous) says...
'If his letter meets the Obama administration's muster, there would be more time - as much as four months - to ask for the funds.'
In otherwords, if Sanford and SC bow low enough and kiss obama's butt, than it will me "the Obama administration's muster".
This is the clown that Sanford is gaving into:
Russia's Medvedev hails 'comrade' Obama
The Russian president contrasted Obama as "totally different" to his predecessor George W. Bush, whom he blamed for the "mistake" of US missile shield plans fiercely opposed by Moscow.
http://sg.news.yahoo.com/afp/20090403...
"totally different" = obama is afraid to stand up for what is right.
Yes, we wouldnt want a missle shield to protect Europe, and we just sold out Poland and the Ukraine, lets now bend over backwards for Iran, N. Korea, Hamas, Syria...Thank you Jimmy Carter 2 = Obama.
British Prime Minister Declares 'The New World Order is Emerging'
http://www.breitbart.tv/html/311353.html
MNSBC's Matthews on Obamas: 'I'm Saying It Again, I'm Getting A Thrill'
"The grooviness, the excitement of being this First American Couple heading towards Marine One, which is cool in itself, heading from there to Air Force One, to a quick flight across the Atlantic, on your own plane. And to meet with the world leaders as like the centerpiece of the world. What? I get-, I'm saying it again, I'm getting a thrill."
SICK, idolatry.
Obama Bows Down to Saudi King Abdullah
"One does not bow or curtsy to a foreign monarch because the gesture symbolizes recognition of her power over her subjects."
http://www.breitbart.tv/?p=311453
April 3, 2009 at 7:03 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
meemz (anonymous) says...
Bravo charlestt! I'm certain there are additional state "handout" programs we could reduce/eliminate to tighten our belt even more.
In my immediate family, we have 3 educators with their masters degree, all of whom are employed by S.C. public schools & none of whom are concerned about their jobs in spite of the scare tactics being used.
I am so tired of hearing about S.C.'s position among the 50 states regarding education as an argument for the $700m. As charlestt stated, shift some responsibility to the parents. Far too many parents here rely on our schools to raise their children, to teach them the basics they should have been taught at home. EDUCATTION STARTS AT HOME. Our teachers are having to stop teaching those who are there to learn in order to address the deplorable behavior of others. We are a state of enablers by throwing money at the problem(s), hoping it will satisfy the noise makers & make everything better. It's high time we reduce and or eiminate some of our handouts and hold people accountable for themselves and their famlies! Bottom line, those who want to be educated are, those who do not are not. All of the printed money in the world will not change that.
Stand firm and tall Governor.
April 3, 2009 at 7:08 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
AMAZING (anonymous) says...
Let's see, Mark Sanfraud has an M.B.A. and
Thomas "halfway-house" Ravenel has an M.B.A. and Tom "goon" Davis is an Lawyer, all three goons are well educated, unfortunately they are as corrupt as the day is long.
April 3, 2009 at 7:13 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
JustMeInSC (anonymous) says...
Why would we pay for a loan we did not benefit from for a generation? What would we leave our kids if we did not "mortgage" their future? What does it say for the South Carolina educational system when the Governor's wife homeschools their children?
I used to mentor at Mary Ford Elementary School a few years ago. We have a mess in our schools, and not just in poor areas. Poor discipline allowed in schools, poor parenting, no value placed on education at home, or in the governor's office it seems.
Our society is run by self-centered "me me me" Leaders (?). What a mess. John McCain, God Bless him, has that deer in the headlights look of November wiped off his face now, and it seems he thanks God he is not at the wheel.
Lets remember unfettered, unregulated capitalism got us where we are. Greed left unchecked, funded by the money of others, the only risk was placed on the trusting.
Ok, Marky-Mark. Fix the schools. Make them something worthy of your little darlings.
April 3, 2009 at 7:45 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
meemz (anonymous) says...
Gringo-
You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him/her drink. Those who want an education, receive one. Those who do not want/care about being educated, do not receive one AND impede the instruction time of those students who are in school to learn. Our schools have far too many boats, without a basic cultural and intellectual educational tide from the time they're constructed until they drag themselves through the pluff mud to the educational ocean. The low tide is only prepetually low to those who choose to take shortcuts. That is, those who rely on society for maintenace and funding. I agree that education is a right to which every child is entitled. All the more reason to hold all parents accountable for doing their part at home prior to their children joining children who have been educated at home and who are losing valuable instruction time while the teachers have to stop repeatedly to address criminal behavior. Funding for irresponsible behavior will serve no purpose. Change will happen when we stop funding the masses in our state who sit on the porch waiting for a check!
"The real problem is the selfish nature of our citizenry who do not want to pay the bill for educating our children, a basic RIGHT to which every child is entitled ("urine drenched" or not). As our citizenry becomes better educated, to borrow a phrase from Reagen, all cultural and intellectual boats rise with the educational tide. Unfortunately, it's perpetual low tide in SC."
April 3, 2009 at 7:48 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
sandnateater (anonymous) says...
Scare tactics, so many people are taken in by scare tactics. It's good to see there are people in this state that get it. you can't spend and tax your way out of financial problems. Don't you hand-out supporters get it? it's not free money. what ever program you start with this money, in two years the state has to take over funding without fed money.
It's like this stimulus supporters...pay now or pay later. if you choose to take the money go further into debt you will owe more and your payments will be higher and you would have added more programs to a struggling economy....why is paying off debt and reducing monthly payments so hard to understand as the best way to manage money. i bet you hand-out supporters are also in a house you can't afford.
Why doesn't the fed gov't put the money directly in the hands of the people and let them decide their own destiny financially....because if they did that, then the gov't would not have control over the people.
this is not brain surgery but some of you educated outside SC don't seem to have much more in the way of education and brains to put down sc schools. Doesn't look like there is much difference between 50 and 25....kinda like qualifying speeds at Bristol.
hahahah....i had to throw that last lne in for blu eyes. lol,
April 3, 2009 at 7:59 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
AMAZING (anonymous) says...
SLED Director Reggie Lloyd is Fuming Mad at Mark Sanford
This is unbelievable!
WATCH VIDEO:
http://www.wistv.com/global/video/fla...
April 3, 2009 at 8 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
karmann (anonymous) says...
I am not in favor of being forced to pay a debt that I did not take on. I am not in favor of SC being required to pay a debt that the federal government is forcing us to pay b/c they messed up. Kudos to Mark Sanford for seeing this.
April 3, 2009 at 8:02 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
shoelaces (anonymous) says...
meemz....You are saying things I have posted in the past. I teach in a Title I school in Charleston County. We receive extra money because of the Title I status. Guess what, y'all??? That hasn't shot us up to an "Excellent" rating. It buys us extra positions in the school...people who don't really do anything.
Before the school experienced "white flight" it was a top performing school. In recent years the school has dropped in enrollment and academic performance.
Now before anyone cries "racist" let me assure you we have our share of low performing, troubled white students and our share of high performing black students....even a few from other countries who are doing quite well. I am just saying when the majority of a school is dominated by parents who simply look at it as free childcare there isn't much we can do.
I can assure you that money does NOT fix the problem. Money does NOT educate children. Parents DO !!! Two quality parents start the job and quality teachers can continue the process.
Unless this federal $$$$ can be used to improve parents, then Obama can keep it.
April 3, 2009 at 8:06 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Larz13 (anonymous) says...
northeastgay reminds me of one of those infant toys where you pull a string and it says the same thing over and over again.
Apparently all of that education he allegedly received didn't teach him to think of an original thought.
April 3, 2009 at 8:08 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
LocalNerd (anonymous) says...
Go Mark go!
April 3, 2009 at 8:12 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
shoelaces (anonymous) says...
Sandnateater.....I agree with you.
"Put money directly in the hands of the people." Of course, "the people" can't be trusted to manage their money properly. The nanny state mentality.
Instead of making it tougher for small businesses through mandates, regulations, taxes, and various requirements, the federal government should put its efforts into supporting the small business.
It is private industry that should be allowed to get us out of this recession, not the government. When the federal government gets its hands on something it can't seem to let go. The more control Washington has the less control we have over our own decisions and fate.
Wasn't this country started a couple hundred years ago to escape a tyrannical government????
April 3, 2009 at 8:13 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
studley (anonymous) says...
Some of the posts here are really amazing!
I want to compliment charlesst for his open and honest expression of his obviously racist views. I find his views repulsive but I admire his honesty. A urine drenched child is to be helped not ridiculed. Perhaps if the child's parents had received something other than an inferior education then their life would be better. Get a life.
Lloyd007 and Gringo59: bros I am on the same wave length.
The governor is supposed to lead not dictate. Sanford is the governor but he is not a leader - unless you consider marching down the path to the bottom as leadership.
As governor, Fritz Hollings was a leader. Among other things, he led in education. His greatest achievement in this area was the outstanding system of technical education colleges we have in SC. He reasoned that a WELL EDUCATED population would attract industry and prosperity would follow. He intended this to benefit all not just a select few. That is, they were not meant to be plantation schools.
The only states that trail SC in public education are Mississippi and Louisiana. Those states have republican governors, too. Does that tell you anything? Why does Jindal want Obama to fail? Because misery loves company!
Wikipedia says Sanford grew up in Ft Lauderdale and moved to a 3,000 acre plantation in Beaufort before his senior year in high school and then graduated from Furman. I wonder how many finacially strapped public schools he attended. Some people don't support public schools because they never experienced them and don't see a need for them. After all, doesn't everyone live on a plantation?
Finally, I, too, have an MBA - among other university degrees. No degree from any school, in and of itself, indicates that the holder is either smart or intelligent. They only indicate that you have overcome some prior level of lack of knowledge.
April 3, 2009 at 8:13 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
crankyyankee (anonymous) says...
What you see in Mark Sanford is real leadership. He doesn't follow the mob or do what's popular like our other elected officals. He doesn't blame anyone but his peers for the mess we're in while all the other elected officals run around pointing fingers at anyone the voters don't like. He doesn't shift with the media winds like your representative does. Most of those whining about not getting their share of the pie have more than likely never done a single thing to serve this Country or it's citizens. Most liberals and socialists don't help others they expect the Government to do it! Any of you whiners served in the military? The peace corps? National guard? I thought so that would require commitment which people with there hands out never seem to have.
April 3, 2009 at 8:19 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
AMAZING (anonymous) says...
"lcsaint03", I'm not a lib or a government employee.
"how much of a fraud and how corrupt Sanford"
The proof is in the pudding my friend.
"The proof of the pudding is in the eating."
It means that the true value or quality of something can
only be judged when it's put to use or tried and tested.
"Results are what count...it's not how you start, but how you finish."
Hey"lcsaint03", taste the pudding! ...isn't it nice?
...it tastes really good, have some more...
April 3, 2009 at 8:29 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
AMAZING (anonymous) says...
crankyyankee said:
"Sanford doesn't follow the mob or do what's popular like our other elected officals."
Sanford doesn't follow the mob, he is the mob.
April 3, 2009 at 8:31 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
rbanks28 (anonymous) says...
To all the dummies that agree with li mark are stupid. We as american were put in this situation because of the g.dumb ass BUSH, so if u ask me he needs to pay for the debt he has us in. but at the same time don't knock President Obama and is team for trying to fix the problem, it did take 8 years to get us into to this mess. So if you want to point fingers direct it at the people who cheated to get bush in the first term and voted for him the second term.
April 3, 2009 at 8:35 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
yird (anonymous) says...
Obama tells the printing office,print billions of little pieces of paper and we'll call it money.
Then we'll give this "money' to the suckers to squander on foolishness.
Now here's the sad part.
Since this imaginary money has no backing (gold, silver, or some other tangible of value) we will take a larger portion of the production of the American workers and offer it up to the Chinese communists as collateral for providing us with their backing for the make believe money we are printing and we will pay them back the equivalent of real money plus interest in the form of labor or resources.
OF course those groveling for this easy way out wont be paying back much of this obligation.
A generation of selfish, pampered, spoiled, brats are greedily taking all they can for themselves and relegating their progeny for future generations to come, to a live of servitude.
You phonies who profess to care so much about the welfare of "the children" are either grossly short sighted or so self absorbed that you don't care one iota bout what happens in the future or who it happens to.
Just give me, me, me, mine!
Y'all were aptly named the me generation.
April 3, 2009 at 8:35 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
ThomP (anonymous) says...
The Governor's stand is based on fiscal conservative principles, and is destined to be proven correct. Accepting this portion of the Federal "stimulus package" will only grow SC government and result in bigger bloated bureaucratic spending requirements down the road ... after the Fed "help" isn't available. Then you and I will really pay! I support Governor Sanford's position against the Federal Government's dangerous plan to grow the government payroll.
April 3, 2009 at 8:37 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
yird (anonymous) says...
Correction++Life of servitude
April 3, 2009 at 8:37 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
AMAZING (anonymous) says...
Thursday, Speaker of the House Bobby Harrell addressed Sanford's tap dance around the stimulus money.
"We adamantly opposed this so-called stimulus bill when it was proposed," Harrell said in a statement. "However, we realize as do most of our state's citizens that because this plan became law South Carolinians will have to repay this money whether we accept it or not. That is why it is so difficult to understand the Governor's rationale for requesting millions in energy efficiency money while rejecting money for teachers and law enforcement officers."
April 3, 2009 at 8:49 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
sdr35hw (anonymous) says...
There are more Chinese restaurants in America than McDonalds. Now we are happy that we borrow money from Red China to buy plastic dog poop from Hong Kong. But its OK because Tom Cruise is bringing it. Those education cuts will be janitors and teachers, the administrators will be OK.
April 3, 2009 at 8:52 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
AMAZING (anonymous) says...
"Gov. Mark Sanford today will comply with a crucial stimulus deadline and become the last governor in the nation to seek millions of dollars in federal economic-recovery funds for his state, aides said late Thursday".
"But Sanford will continue contesting $700 million in education and law enforcement money for South Carolina that he wants to spend on debt. Sanford's eleventh-hour move to meet today's midnight deadline buys time for a possible compromise with lawmakers over how to spend the money, as the state's schools chief warned Thursday of mass teacher layoffs and SLED Chief Reggie Lloyd warned of draconian cuts without the stimulus."
http://www.wolfereports.com/?p=902
April 3, 2009 at 8:52 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
BlackReign (anonymous) says...
Posted by studley 'The governor is supposed to lead not dictate.' ------ Can we apply that rule to obama?
Posted by studley 'As governor, Fritz Hollings was a leader.'
**NEWS FLASH**
Ernest Frederick "Fritz" Hollings Governor of South Carolina (1959-1963)
During his governorship, he signed legislation ordering the Confederate Flag to be raised over the state capital to commemorate the 100th anniversary of South Carolina's secession from the union, and to protest the growing Civil Rights Movement. While governor, Hollings supported racial segregation.
Now that is leadership! LOL, go back to la la land studless!
THE MONEY IS BORROWED! It has nothing to back it up, except our GDP, and that is looking pretty ulgy with the death of the Auto makers, and other manufacturing businesses that have been killed by over regulation by the feds (CAFE standards) and over paid union members.
Why dont the democrats use the term 'Mortgaging Our Children's Future' anymore?
April 3, 2009 at 8:53 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
ThomP (anonymous) says...
RE: AMAZING at 8:49am
The Governor's rational is only difficult to understand if you (or Bobby Harrell) are really short sighted. There are strings attached to this money, and spending it on perpetually growing programs will not help SC in the long run. It's like someone giving me the down-payment on a million dollar house. If I take it ... and close on the deal ... then I only hope that they help with the monthly payments ... but they won't. That's the problem. I now have obligations I can't afford. Get it?
April 3, 2009 at 8:58 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Whopper (anonymous) says...
To hell with the Feds. They can't give away $ to a different state and then recoup it from our state later. I would rather see Stanford stand up for state rights and get a court decision on whether the feds can dictate to states what they can do with their own money. The easy posistion is that Sanford is doing this for national attention but the reality is that Sanford is a very principled person and he is right in this situation. How dare the feds make the states grovel for $ the feds do not even have to begin with. If you don't understand state rights, no amount of $ for education will change the fact that you were born to be a ditch digger . . . and you probably deserve a pink slip for being lame at that. Have a good weekend everyone.
April 3, 2009 at 8:58 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
AMAZING (anonymous) says...
Mark Sanford Spelling Song
VIDEO:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?doc...
April 3, 2009 at 8:59 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
BlackReign (anonymous) says...
ThomP, dont waste your time, AMAZING is a complete whack job with some kind of sick, perverted hate for Sanford. He/she is a flamer and a waste of time.
April 3, 2009 at 9:03 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
TsQc (anonymous) says...
I date a teacher, and I cannot believe the stories she brings home from the classroom. I have never known before I started dating her that the public school system was in such bad shape. The teacher's will suffer in this situation, and it's not because of the money it's because of the parents, scratch that, parent...Scratch that, single mom at the bars every night trying to find the next baby daddy..Or the dad that fathers so many children and then leaves. The teachers will suffer once again, the teachers that buy everything for their classrooms and sometimes for the children. Only to find out that the childs "parent" sold his/her new clothes to go out partying. The teacher's and the children suffer with this one, while the "parent" sits back and takes his/her check.
April 3, 2009 at 9:07 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
ThomP (anonymous) says...
RE: BlackReign @9:03
Yer right, of course. Q: why is common sense so often ignored? Thanks.
April 3, 2009 at 9:11 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
UrGatorbait (anonymous) says...
Judging from the first post on, education has never been a big priority for South Carolina. Mill workers and labor jobs don't require much.
Why should people have to be saved from starvation? What a pathetic society some have become.
It's debt, more debt on more debt and WW2 helped clear the last debt, then fueled the military industrial complex that helps stay in conflict. I digress.
Let somebody stand up for states rights. Of course people want more debt, its the way to prosperity!! What idiots. The feds are slowly nibbling away at the 10th amendment and people don't care. Where were all you folks when education was under funded when money was flowing? Where was the indignation? Now it's the 11th hour, the hayseeds cut education and now it's a problem? Lack of prior planning but then again South Carolina accepts nothing better than mediocrity anyway.
April 3, 2009 at 9:16 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
gringo59 (anonymous) says...
TsQc ----
Hard to imagine that one could take such an overly simplistic an unrealistic view. You are spouting spin rather than truth.
You're right, teachers will suffer! Because pay sucks and with dwindling $ class size will increase dramatically (already has begun). I don't know why anyone would choose to teach, yet my wife gets up every morning to make to here elementary job by 6:50 a.m. to give it all she's got for the good of all, all of her kids.
The old worn out arguments passing blame around totally misses the victims: the kids, the teachers and our the very fabric of our state and nation.
Perhaps we should send our kids to India to get a real education.
April 3, 2009 at 9:20 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
newsreader74 (anonymous) says...
What I think a lot of people are missing in this argument is an understanding of what we (those opposed to the stimulus) are actually opposing. If the Federal Government had gone into its reserves and pulled out $700,000,000.00 in real money and offered it, I think Sanford and the rest of us would all support taking it. However, since instead the Federal Government created the money through debt selling (mostly to communist China) - which we understand destabilizes the dollar (which is only worth its implied / compared value to other currencies). We oppose the entire process. This is bad business in a big way, which is worse since the Federal Government has been doing this in a big way since the 70s.
Our opinion is based on simple, straightforward, proven economics. At some point the world market will consider the US debt a bad investment, the dollar will lose significant value, inflation will spike, and a gallon of milk will cost you $25.00 or $30.00 seemingly overnight. Obama's guys understand this and instead of doing the right and hard choice, they are trying to delay the impact by coordinating a worldwide policy that gets everyone in this bad business. They also are open to future currencies to replace the dollar, which would be the ultimate move in this shell game style management. This isn't far off propping up a Ponze scheme.
Inflation like this will hurt the entire population and the poor the most. What we dumb 'rednecks' or 'backwards' folk are opposing is bad policy. Please take a moment to consider the larger picture. And don't drop back to the argument that since the decision is made it is all right to take the money or another state will get it. That's like finding out your employer pays your salary by stealing from starving orphans, but you keep taking it because 'it's not your fault how he got the money'. It' called guilt by association.
April 3, 2009 at 9:23 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
gringo59 (anonymous) says...
IF you read your history of this great state... people had to be saved from starvation because of the high unemployment in the midst of the great depression. I suppose so many people were out of work because they were lazy or freeloaders looking for a handout.
April 3, 2009 at 9:25 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
BlackReign (anonymous) says...
Some great (read rational) posts about the money already being spent on schools in SC:
http://www.charleston.net/news/2009/a...
April 3, 2009 at 9:26 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
icbmman (anonymous) says...
I propose that AMAZING is a state Democrat party plant basically trying to smear the governor with ridiculous accusations in preparation the next governor election. His rants are basically incoherent ramblings, combined with random links showing "mad, fuming" bureaucrats who think that their agencies will die without the stimulus. Notice that he/she does not even address any of the intelligent arguments from Get_Serious, wegwam, and others. Just rambles on like a little child.
It appears that Sanford broke under pressure, and that is really sad; it shows the huge disconnect between state Republicans (who are complicit with the legislature's IDIOCY) and their sitting governor who at least shows some conservative principles. It's also apparent that there are no real conservatives in the Republican party, even in the state legislature!
Long live perestroika, comrades.
April 3, 2009 at 9:27 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
shoelaces (anonymous) says...
So, what's the solution to our education problem?
Anyone? Anyone....??
April 3, 2009 at 9:28 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
TsQc (anonymous) says...
gringo-
Didn't you just agree with everything I said prior? Are you spouting spin as well? Or is this truth because you said it?
I said the teachers and the kids will be the victims. They already are the victims and the people responsible for that are the parents.
Maybe we should send children abroad to be taught. The world is well on it's way to surpassing the education given to the children here in the U.S. And I don't blame the children nor the teachers for that.
April 3, 2009 at 9:28 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
studley (anonymous) says...
BlackReign: I didn't say Hollings was perfect. Are you?
Hollings did have a true change of heart. He did testify before congress that SC had passed laws and actively pursue policies that were detrimental to the progress of African Americans.
That is leadership!
April 3, 2009 at 9:30 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
robert8096 (anonymous) says...
To all the dummies that agree with li mark are stupid. We as american were put in this situation because of the g.dumb ass BUSH, so if u ask me he needs to pay for the debt he has us in. but at the same time don't knock President Obama and is team for trying to fix the problem, it did take 8 years to get us into to this mess. So if you want to point fingers direct it at the people who cheated to get bush in the first term and voted for him the second term.
How may times are we going to see this lame excuse that Bush got us in this mess. It was Clinton who relaxed the lending laws and made mortgage companies give bad loans to people who could not afford the payments. Of course those who jumped on those loans are the exact people looking of Obama to bail them out with non existent money. Bush was no savior and had his faults but he did not get us into this mess.
I worked in the school system for 10+ years and I can tell you that the children who wanted to lean did and those who didn't were the ones causing the problem and every time the parents of those kids were called to a meeting at school it was " My little Johnny wouldn't do that and you are just picking on him" Those kids will be our future criminals and just like their mommy and daddy be in line for the government handouts.
Go Sanford don't take the funny money.
April 3, 2009 at 9:32 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
BlackReign (anonymous) says...
Posted by gringo59 'IF you read your history of this great state... people had to be saved from starvation because of the high unemployment in the midst of the great depression.'
WHAT? You need to read your history, places like Detroit, Chicago, NYC, had masses out of work during the Great Depression.
And this is nothing close to the great depression, any way shape or form. Those folks didnt lay around whining and crying for uncle sam and the nanny state to save their collective butts. Men traveled hundreds of miles to feed their families. They didnt sit around waiting on handouts from the government and stradle massive debt on their children's backs.
You only have to go back to the late 70s, to see a worse situation than the current one.
April 3, 2009 at 9:32 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
UrGatorbait (anonymous) says...
The kids are pawns in the "adults" folly. Then we watch the wizards here play politics with it acting like each other or the other side is at fault. You idiots are enabling the stupidity. Carry on.
April 3, 2009 at 9:32 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Zod (anonymous) says...
ThomP, your analogy doesn't fit. Here is an analogy that does fit.
"Like it or not, you will pay me for the beach house that I just recently built for the life of my loan. I am telling you that you can live in that beach house for 1/8 of the year for said payment. You are so retarded that you would rather spend that 1/8 of the year on the street."
April 3, 2009 at 9:34 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
gringo59 (anonymous) says...
TsQc-
Not helpful to blame poor and uneducated parents for not taking more responsibility. Yes, many could and should be better parents. We can't legislate that. We can, however, provide the best possible circumstance for kids who don't have the kind of support at home that my children have had. Could the system be improved? Hell yes! This is after all, SC! But it serves only to wedge and distract to blame poor unsophisticated uneducated people for failures in our schools. Likewise, many of the worst behaved children are from affluent families who's kids live with a kind of entitlement mentality. Again, teachers suffer far more than their meager compensation is worth.
April 3, 2009 at 9:35 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Get_seriousHELP (anonymous) says...
Posted by robert8096 "To all the dummies that agree with li mark are stupid. We as american were put in this situation because of the g.dumb ass BUSH..."
Yet another blame Bush drone!
Once again:
Clinton Signed the Legislation Overhauling Banking Laws in November 13, 1999, WITH the help of Republicans.
BUT IT LED TO THIS;
Fannie Mae Eases Credit To Aid Mortgage Lending
By STEVEN A. HOLMES
Published: Thursday, September 30, 1999
In a move that could help increase home ownership rates among minorities and low-income consumers, the Fannie Mae Corporation is easing the credit requirements on loans that it will purchase from banks and other lenders.
http://www.nytimes.com/1999/09/30/bus...
Fannie Mayhem: A History
Fannie's Inside Info 07/01/02 Even in this post-Enron world, Fan and Fred do not provide as much information about these securities as private mortgage lenders do.
Inside Fannie 03/19/02 Fan and Fred don't function like other companies. They're allowed to pile up debt, implicitly guaranteed by taxpayers, without being held to even the minimum of corporate governance standards.
Frantic Fannie 02/28/02 Companies taking on so much risk and debt, and backed by taxpayers, ought to be more transparent in what they tell the world.
Fannie Mae Enron? 02/20/02 Fan and Fred look like poorly run hedge funds: lots of leverage and snarkily hedged risk. Does the word Enron ring any bells?
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB12159...
New Agency Proposed to Oversee Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae
By STEPHEN LABATON
The Bush administration today recommended the most significant regulatory overhaul in the housing finance industry since the savings and loan crisis a decade ago.
Under the plan, disclosed at a Congressional hearing today, a new agency would be created within the Treasury Department to assume supervision of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, the government-sponsored companies that are the two largest players in the mortgage lending industry.
"These two entities - Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac - are not facing any kind of financial crisis," said Representative Barney Frank of Massachusetts, the ranking Democrat on the Financial Services Committee. "The more people exaggerate these problems, the more pressure there is on these companies, the less we will see in terms of affordable housing."
http://www.nytimes.com/2003/09/11/bus...
April 3, 2009 at 9:37 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Get_seriousHELP (anonymous) says...
Democrats defended their policy of "BANK AFFIRMATIVE ACTION;
U.S. REP. MAXINE WATERS (D-CALIFORNIA):
"Mr. Chairman, we do not have a crisis at Freddie Mac, and in particular at Fannie Mae, under the outstanding leadership of Mr. Frank Raines. Everything in the 1992 act has worked just fine. In fact, the GSEs have exceeded their housing goals.
"What we need to do today is to focus on the regulator, and this must be done in a manner so as not to impede their [Fannie and Freddie's]
affordable housing mission, a mission that has seen innovation
flourish from desktop underwriting to 100 percent loans."
U.S. REP. BARNEY FRANK (D-MASSACHUSETTS):
".... I think it is clear that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac are sufficiently secure so they are in no great
danger. And I was glad to have Secretary Snow say when he
testified that this is not something we are doing in response to a crisis. For once, Congress is getting out ahead of a problem.....In this case, we are taking some anticipatory steps...."
Fannie Mae CEO calling Obama and the Dems the "Family" and "Conscience" of Fannie Mae
Democrats Were Wrong on Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac
October 06, 2008 05:10 PM ET
Seventeen. That's how many times, according to this White House statement (hat tip Gateway Pundit), that the Bush administration has called for tighter regulation of the government-sponsored enterprises (GSEs) Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. Congress has cooperated only once. In spring 2007, as House Financial Services Committee Chairman Barney Frank likes to point out, the House did pass a bill in response. The Senate did not act until 2008; Senate Banking Committee Chairman Christopher Dodd spent most of 2007 camped out in Iowa running for president. The legislation passed by Congress in 2008 enabled Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson to put Fannie and Freddie into federal conservatorship this summer when they failed. But it didn't prevent them from spewing a huge amount of toxic waste, in the form of subprime and Alt-A mortgages, into our financial institutions from 2004 to 2007.
http://www.usnews.com/blogs/barone/20...
April 3, 2009 at 9:38 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
robert8096 (anonymous) says...
No, not another blame Bush drone. That was a quote from an above poster. I know that Bush did not create the problem, Clinton created the current problem!
April 3, 2009 at 9:41 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
gringo59 (anonymous) says...
Okay, BlackReign...
With gas at such high price, where would you suggest people travel today (100) miles to find work to feed their families. In days to which you allude, men may have traveled to work on building a highway system, or system of dams, generators, public buildings, etc. Many of the jobs 100 miles away were made possible by post depression government stimulus, not as a handout, but a common investment in our collective national interests.
Everytime we drive down I26 to Charleston or I95 to Hilton Head, we're benefitting from Gov. stimulus that created incredible infrastructure and thousands of jobs.
April 3, 2009 at 9:41 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
SCdeacinNYC (anonymous) says...
UrGator, I don't think the question is really education being under funded. I think with the budget shortfalls though there may be some harsh cuts on a system that doesn't really need it. I've come to the conclusion that the state has become heavily dependent on sales tax as a revenue base rather than income tax and that's where it'll continue to get in trouble. THAT's the reason why arbitrary taxes like the cigarette tax will continue to rise to make up for loss revenue. SC, like many other states when they had surpluses continued spending and cut taxes. They got forms of sales tax specifically which the state is heavily reliant on.
Btu let me back up, I've been investigating our state budget and while I still haven't figured out what this debt is that Sanford is talking about (mostly what it consists of and who we owe it to, most of what I've seen claims it is actually longstanding committments rather than traditional debts) I did find some information on the state budget:
http://www.budget.sc.gov/OSB-faq.phtm
So, SC like most states have a budget that's broken down and split between Federal Funds (money directly funneled from the Fed Govt obviously) and General Funds (money from Income and Retail taxes). I'm going to completely ignore the Federal funds except to say that in general the state gets back more in federal funds than it gives in federal income taxes, so I'm not too concerned about that. General Funds are about 6.7 billion and here is the breakdown of how they are spent.
http://www.budget.sc.gov/webfiles/OSB...
(Not sure what the ALL OTHER is about)
More telling to me though is the way in which the revenue sources for the General Funds are split.
http://www.budget.sc.gov/webfiles/OSB...
About 44-40% between income and sales tax. Just to see the difference I checked out across the border, NC's budget most of the tax revenue comes from income taxes (56-27). Why then two years ago was our governor and legislature cutting taxes just because they could. People are on here claiming that Sanford is the only one that isn't short-sighted. I think his actions were very short-sighted and both him and the legislature are to blame. You can't cut several taxes, especially heavily needed sales tax, continue spending and then think that it won't be a problem. Both he and the legislature were warned back in 2007 about the possible recession, but neither listened. They are both to blame and now we're supposed to be championing him because he refuses to take less than 10% of the stimulus money as if the state wasn't already half dependent on federal money. I'm not impressed.
April 3, 2009 at 9:42 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
nochasgirl (anonymous) says...
While I do not claim to know the answer to this issue, I cannot understand how we cannot accept this money if we will have to pay it back regardless of where it goes. I did not vote for Mark Sanford in his first election simply because he did not send his children to public school when they lived on the island. Sullivans Island Elementary is one of the best schools in SC, and yet he sent his children to private school. Why would he work to improve public education?
April 3, 2009 at 9:43 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
vuduchld (anonymous) says...
Sen. Tom Davis, a Beaufort Republican and Sanford's former chief of staff, claimed that there is still time, in fact two years worth of time, for Sanford to take the money in question.
This part of the article is the height of stupidity emanating from the looney tune leaders in your state. All of the states, even states that initially had reservations about the funding have accepted the money and begun to implement it on their programs. For South Carolina to be at this juncture is not only sorry but inexcusable.
People, South Carolina does not have the luxury of time. This comic idea about having "two years worth of time" smacks of a complete lack of leadership and sheer irresponsibility. Since 2003, this country has been funding the Iraq war to the tune of $US 1.5B a week. The same chicken heads who had blood lust in their hearts never questioned the fact about "paying the money back". Guess what people, THAT MONEY HAS TO BE PAID BACK TOO! At this juncture, South Carolina doesn't deserve ANY stimulus funds let alone the less than 10 per cent of that in question.
If you folks want to continue to pull up the rear in all things considered relevant in our society trust me, others in our nation could care less. I was born and raised in SC and frankly, I could give a good snot about you silly folks advancing yourselves in the new century. If Mark Sanfraud and Tom Davis are the best you pilgrims can do for bogus leadership then your state deserves not ONE PENNY of stimulus funding. I mean let's face it why should the rest of our nation continue to plow money into a broken down Yugo!!
April 3, 2009 at 9:45 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
BlackReign (anonymous) says...
Posted by studley on April 3, 2009 at 9:30 a.m. (Suggest removal)
BlackReign: I didn't say Hollings was perfect. Are you?"
Yes! I am.
--------------------
Gatorbait is right, this is a waste of time and energy. Lets just keep running up the debt and say to hell with the future of American children. And more money will not change a dang thing when it comes to education.
How the hell, we becane such a strong industrial nation, and put a man on the moon with 1 room school houses and just the ole reading writing and arithmetic, is beyond me.
Why dont the democrats use the term 'Mortgaging Our Children's Future' anymore?
April 3, 2009 at 9:45 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Thefutureisnow (anonymous) says...
lloyd007, you hit the nail squarely on the head. The majority in this state behave as though the Civil War is ABOUT to be fought and they are ramping up towards fighting it. The mentality here is totally 19th century at best. We will always be last or second from last in every major category.
April 3, 2009 at 9:46 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
nature_lover (anonymous) says...
Obama may have inherited the problem, but let's be clear about who he inherited it from - not Bush alone, but a spend loving congress. I'm embarassed about the entitlement minded Clyburn - he represents how we got in this position. Everyone's entitled, right? What famous democrat said, "Ask not what...". That's right, the first president to run a deficit. They only quote him when it's convenient for them.
Question: How do you dupe the American people into believing you are actually going to cut the deficit in half by the end of your first team?
Answer: Triple it first.
April 3, 2009 at 9:47 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Get_seriousHELP (anonymous) says...
Posted by robert8096 on April 3, 2009 at 9:41 a.m. (Suggest removal)
No, not another blame Bush drone. That was a quote from an above poster. I know that Bush did not create the problem, Clinton created the current problem!"
My deepest apologies
April 3, 2009 at 9:48 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
gringo59 (anonymous) says...
I forget ... didn't clinton leave us a surplus? What happened to that?
April 3, 2009 at 9:51 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
studley (anonymous) says...
BlackReign: Since you are perfect you should take your rant elsewhere and leave us mere mortals!
April 3, 2009 at 9:51 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
wegwam (anonymous) says...
Anybody know the difference between schools in asia and schools in our country?
my friends of this great state the answer is DISCIPLINE.
April 3, 2009 at 9:53 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
ThomP (anonymous) says...
RE: ZOD @9:34am
Thanks for the insight. But, actually, I don't want to live in your beach house ... so I won't ... and I won't be paying you for that 1/8th share either. I won't live long enough. My grandkids will have to help you pay off your mortgage. Sad, yes?
April 3, 2009 at 9:53 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Get_seriousHELP (anonymous) says...
Posted by nature
"Obama may have inherited the problem, but let's be clear about who he inherited it from - not Bush alone, but a spend loving congress."
Dont forget, that Obama was part of the US Senate for several years, that is, when he wasnt running his 2 year campaign. Obama voted with fellow Democrats in the Senate 97 percent of the time.
April 3, 2009 at 9:54 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
UrGatorbait (anonymous) says...
SCdeac,
Sales taxes are the life blood of this state. When the money was plentiful, debt was still run up the wazzo and here we are stuck again with the politicians and the partisan lemmings of both sides pointing fingers again.
deac, it's some clever accounting work. Like stats, you can make them say anything. I want to know where that $578 mil Sanford alluded to in the stories yesterday is at or did ever exist? Politicians are part of the mob.
April 3, 2009 at 9:54 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
BillytheKid (anonymous) says...
He has a sick bone in his body that causes him to make a bad desision and stick with it through thick and thin, we don't need that kind of thinking leading us.
April 3, 2009 at 9:54 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Larz13 (anonymous) says...
Every time I see the Piggly Wiggly logo I think of Fritz Hollings.
This weasel wallowed in so much pork so that he could get his name on every building, overpass and outhouse in the state. His name is even on the parking garage at the Charleston Airport!
April 3, 2009 at 9:55 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Zod (anonymous) says...
I'll take that one on "shoelaces"....
At the successful conclusion of ninth grade they all graduate. Then there is a competition for jobs. Then they compete for jobs. They compete for jobs based upon what they have accomplished in the aforementioned education. Not one citizen is ever allowed to pay for an accredited education. Business will hire the young men and women to apprentice. Who knows? They may even have to scrub a toilet or two. If the individual proves himself to be worthy through hard work, loyalty and effor - the business will invest in further educating the young person.
It may sound crazy but the idea will utterly destroy the premise that one deserves anything BEFORE ever investing a days labor in the effort.
April 3, 2009 at 9:55 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Get_seriousHELP (anonymous) says...
The Myth of the Clinton Surplus
The claim is generally made that Clinton had a surplus of $69 billion in FY1998, $123 billion in FY1999 and $230 billion in FY2000 . In that same link, Clinton claimed that the national debt had been reduced by $360 billion in the last three years, presumably FY1998, FY1999, and FY2000--though, interestingly, $360 billion is not the sum of the alleged surpluses of the three years in question ($69B + $123B + $230B = $422B, not $360B).
While not defending the increase of the federal debt under President Bush, it's curious to see Clinton's record promoted as having generated a surplus. It never happened. There was never a surplus and the facts support that position. In fact, far from a $360 billion reduction in the national debt in FY1998-FY2000, there was an increase of $281 billion.
http://www.craigsteiner.us/articles/16
April 3, 2009 at 9:56 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Get_seriousHELP (anonymous) says...
By dramatically defunding the military and intelligence agencies the Clinton Administration was able to show on paper a projected 10 year federal budget surplus. The terrorists attacks of September 11th occured. The Bush Administration needed to dramatically refund the defunded military and intelligence agencies. This is how the the Bush Administration "squandered" the surplus.
April 3, 2009 at 9:58 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Zod (anonymous) says...
ThomP, I don't care. Someone is paying for it. You would think that your grandchildren would at least like to know that YOU benefitted from their dollar.
Nope! You would rather 49 other states (and territories) live in the beach house during your time while the old grandchildren still pay the bill.
April 3, 2009 at 9:59 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
gringo59 (anonymous) says...
Get_serious... get real
Your president W sent us a tax rebate as soon as he could because he said he surplus belonged to us. Wonder why he thought that if there was no surplus revenue. Or, maybe he didn't have your sense of the facts. Or, maybe he knew what you say you know and pandered to the people sending rebate checks running up debt.
April 3, 2009 at 10:02 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
eatmorecollards (anonymous) says...
Sanford is just playing politics. He's in the news against the stimulus as being hyper inflationary. If it proves the case, he is proven right. If it doesn't, he hasn't lost any thing. I think we will end up with all of it anyways.
If the stimulus proves to be hyper inflationary, dollars wont be worth much overseas. US citizens will stay home. Illegals wont come here to work for dollars. Only rich Europeans will come to buy our cheap goods.
Countries that bought into our economy will loose big time because the money they spent will be worth more than the cash in they can get on it.
Property values will go back up because it will take more money to buy anything in the US. Pay and benefits will have to increase as more money is released into our system. Other countries will loose out as factories come back to the US for cheap labor and protection from the angry mobs.
May not be a bad thing. We had better keep our military strong though.
April 3, 2009 at 10:02 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Larz13 (anonymous) says...
Clinton and a dumbo-crat congress signed into law the Community Reinvestment Act which mandated banks making risky loans to people with shaky credit--THAT, ultimately is what caused the problem we are in now. The MSM won't report it, but legitimate economic analysis shows that is where it started. Bush tried to reign in on Freddie/Fannie but jerks like Dodd, Frank and Clyburn opposed. Look at the campaign filing reports, all took tons of $$ from them and the likes of AIG.
April 3, 2009 at 10:08 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
icbmman (anonymous) says...
Get_Serious, great fact finding, but I'm afraid that it's worth about as much as pissing in the wind with these socialist lemmings. They won't listen to you or look at the facts, they just know that Czar Obama will give them a utopia for the rest of their lives.
Socialism is here in this nation, and now in this state. So many people have been deluded by the media and the president into thinking that this stimulus is ENTITLED to them. The basic premise is also a lie...this $700 million is NOT "funds"!! It is a loan, a credit.
Well comrades, I hope we enjoy the USSA...anybody want to put the sickle and hammer on our flag in place of the stars. Lenin and Stalin would be proud.
April 3, 2009 at 10:09 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
gringo59 (anonymous) says...
So many "facts" parrot limbaugh and beck rather than coming from thinking amerkans.
April 3, 2009 at 10:13 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Zod (anonymous) says...
serioushelp,
Clinton and the republican congress were in fact responsible for surpluses in the US budget for the FISCAL years mentioned. Let's take your personal budget for example.
You owe 20 million dollars gaining interest at 5% annually.
You made 1 million dollars this past year.
You spent 750,000 dollars this past year.
After paying all your debts (including payments on your 20 million worht of debt) you saw a net surplus of 250,000 dollars. Now that 250,000 could not put a dent in your 20 million dollar debt. So the annual percentage rate of 5% actually caused an increase in your total debt.
What Clinton takes credit for is that he didn't put anything on the charge card and he actually made extra payments on the debt that his predecessors ran up on the charge card.
I can understand one protesting that he would take credit for spending bills passed by a Republican congress. I can also understand finding fault with not saving more than that as it was the best of times. But I take this moment to remind you that per the constitution, the US House of Representatives is charged with the introduction of every dollar that the US government will spend. Who had control of the two legislative bodies during the largest economic expansion known to man? In other words, who had the ability to pay down the debt and refused to do so?
April 3, 2009 at 10:19 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
beespencer (anonymous) says...
Please like to praise Sanford, but is he offering a better solution??
April 3, 2009 at 10:22 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
wegwam (anonymous) says...
back in the ussa
you dont know how lucky you are
back in the us
back in the us
back in the ussa
well the lefty lovers really knock me out
they leave the freedom behind
and dc crooks make me twist and shout
them politicians always on my my my my my my wallet
oh come on
hey hu hey ah yea
yea yea yea
im back in the ussa
you dont know how lucky you are, taxpayers
back in the ussa
April 3, 2009 at 10:57 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Ethan57 (anonymous) says...
Unemployment payments are part of an insurance program, not a handout, the same as your home/auto/life insurance. Employers pay a premium into that fund as a cost of doing business in every state in the country. Wanna get angry at something? How about social security? After 7 years, with interest and adjusted for inflation, the average social security beneficiary has gotten back 100 percent of the money contributed in their working lifetime. The rest is FREE. Unemployment taxes do not come out of your pocket but social security dollars do. Yet do people call these retirees deadbeats? Not so much. If any of you have been collecting social security for more than 7 years I say let taxpayers have their money back. You won't do it but you WILL gripe about those receiving "insurance" payments.
April 3, 2009 at 11:14 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
real_news (anonymous) says...
Gov Sanford of SC is best example of what lunatics Republicans are, specially in todays Global economy where Governments such as Europeans make vast investments in their people & cities via such Social services as Universal Health Care and much more.
About Gov Sanford being best example of what lunatics Republicans are, here is why:
Gov Sanford has said that he will not take some of the Stimulus money that the Obama/Dems have set aside for state of South Carolina as part of the Stimulus package. Thus depriving State of SC from 10s of 1000s of high paying Job and also depriving 10s of 1000s of South Carolina residents who have lost their Job due to no fault of their own from greater unemployment benefits at the time that the state desperately needs these new Jobs and additional payments, specially when considering the FACT that SC has the 2nd highest unemployment rate in the nation.
So just think about this FACT for a moment: Republicans were for a $2Trillion total waste of our money on the totally unnecessary Iraq War but they are against the expenditure of $800Bill of our money on American people & cities to create new Schools, build new Roads, extend Unemployment, etc. investment in American people!
If that is not the definition of Lunatic thinking, what is?
For sake of this post not getting 2 long here, you can read the full article in this regard here:
http://www.anoox.com/news/show_select...
April 3, 2009 at 11:14 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
gringo59 (anonymous) says...
well the lefty lovers really knock me out
they leave the freedom behind
Really.... the greatest assault on our freedoms did not come at the hands of a so-called "lefty" unless W is left handed.
April 3, 2009 at 11:20 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
geekboy (anonymous) says...
Gov Sanford of SC is best example of what lunatics Republicans are, specially in todays Global economy where Governments such as Europeans make vast investments in their people & cities via such Social services as Universal Health Care and much more.
About Gov Sanford being best example of what lunatics Republicans are, here is why:
Gov Sanford has said that he will not take some of the Stimulus money that the Obama/Dems have set aside for state of South Carolina as part of the Stimulus package. Thus depriving State of SC from 10s of 1000s of high paying Job and also depriving 10s of 1000s of South Carolina residents who have lost their Job due to no fault of their own from greater unemployment benefits at the time that the state desperately needs these new Jobs and additional payments, specially when considering the FACT that SC has the 2nd highest unemployment rate in the nation.
So just think about this FACT for a moment: Republicans were for a $2Trillion total waste of our money on the totally unnecessary Iraq War but they are against the expenditure of $800Bill of our money on American people & cities to create new Schools, build new Roads, extend Unemployment, etc. investment in American people!
If that is not the definition of Lunatic thinking, what is?
******************************************************
Your post.
April 3, 2009 at 11:24 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Jennifer123 (anonymous) says...
This money is not a gift: it has to be paid for. This quasi experiment with socialism is going to be a disaster for this country. It is not right put this tax burden on a few. It will not be long before the top wage earners get feed up with this punitive tax system and stop producing and investing. The private sector produces wealth, while the government does nothing but consume it. This rate of consumption is not sustainable.
I don't believe that money will solve the school system mess; nonetheless, for those that do, why don't you ask The Carnegie Foundation, The Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, or The Rockefeller Foundation for a grant? There are hundreds foundations, with billions of dollars, that voluntarily donate money to support education efforts. Hell, ask Oprah for all I care, but stop burdening the taxpayers.
Instead of increasing taxes, eliminate all wasteful spending. So, no more: parades, barbeque festivals, okra struts (whatever that is), museums, and recreational centers. Everyone knows where the beach is and where they can buy peaches, tomatoes and barbeque. I love barbeque as much as the next person: I've eaten for breakfast for God's sake, but all this wasteful spending and earmarks have to stop. Enough already!
April 3, 2009 at 11:25 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
AMAZING (anonymous) says...
Granholm makes it clear: We'll take leftover stimulus funds
WASHINGTON Just in case anyone missed it the first several times she said so, Gov. Jennifer Granholm wants to make it perfectly clear:
Michigan would really, really like to be at the top of the list for getting any stimulus funds governors in other parts of the country might return.
She said so in a letter to Vice President Joe Biden on Thursday, putting it this way, "Michigan would like to be first in line."
http://www.freep.com/article/20090403...
*********************************************************
Granholm to V-P: We'll take extra stimulus cash
Lansing -- While some governors have said they don't want federal recovery act cash, Gov. Jennifer Granholm is trying to grab every last penny she can get for Michigan.
She has said repeatedly that Michigan will take the money other states reject, and now she has made a formal request to Vice President Joe Biden.
"When you consider reallocating the money that has been turned down, Michigan would like to be first in line," the governor said in a letter to Biden sent Thursday. "In these most difficult economic times, the recovery act is exactly what our state needs to protect our citizens and help get them working again."
http://www.detnews.com/article/200904...
April 3, 2009 at 11:47 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Larz13 (anonymous) says...
Granholm has pissed away so much $$, she would gladly take more....she is a Canadian socialist. Kissing the butts of unions, it is not a surprise that the automakers are in such trouble. Sort of like a slut taking all she can.
April 3, 2009 at 11:54 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
LuckyDay (anonymous) says...
When I read the backward comments on this page, I can understand why the war to maintain the institution of slavery was started in South Carolina. It's still the same shallow gene pool. Now, given that, it just might be best to stroke our ideological bias and refuse funds that our taxpayers must repay. I don't think that $700 million, or $700 billion for that matter, would do any good to de-bubba this state. So let North Carolina and Georgia have it. People there might just be smart enough to put it to good use. You can take bubba out of the country, but you can't take the country out of bubba
April 3, 2009 at 11:55 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
geekboy (anonymous) says...
Posted by AMAZING on April 3, 2009 at 11:47 a.m. (Suggest removal)
********************************
Here's a novel idea. Why not make a single, gigantic worthless post so that the rest of us don't have to hunt for posts actually worth reading among all the trash you think needs to be posted?
April 3, 2009 at 11:57 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
AMAZING (anonymous) says...
Larz13, you sound a little worried that the governor of Michigan is going to make your "gansta" governor Sanfraud look bad.
At this point, I don't think it would surprise anyone if South Carolina's unemployment rate surpassed Michigan's unemployment rate.
April 3, 2009 at noon ( permalink | suggest removal )
PersicaPit (anonymous) says...
You know, maybe I'm crazy, but I really don't mind my tax dollars paying for things like improving our state's dismal public schools, or creating jobs (has everyone forgotten that South Carolina is still ranked second only to Michigan in unemployment?), or improving and updating crumbling infrastructure -- like overhauling our outdated drainage system, which just yesterday caused citywide problems again. Maybe I'm insane, but aren't these the things our taxes are SUPPOSED to be paying for?
Governor Sanford, you've made your point. You've proven loud and clear that you are loyal to your party and that you oppose this bill. Everyone knows it. Good for you. Now, do what the rest of your fellow Republicans have done -- take the freaking money and rescue your state before we all drown.
April 3, 2009 at 12:01 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
KidYendor (anonymous) says...
Sung to the tune of "We Love You Conrad"
We love Mark Sanford
oh yes we do,
say no to Leathermam
and Clyburn too.
Debts must be paid off
or loans haunt youuuu,
oh Mark Sanford we love you.
April 3, 2009 at 12:01 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
AMAZING (anonymous) says...
Mark "gangsta" Sanfraud.
Now, that has a nice ring to it.
April 3, 2009 at 12:05 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
sandnateater (anonymous) says...
persicapiy,
obviously another transplant that knows everything....first off the drainage problem in the city is geographic not economic. know the difference?
secondly you might think spending is the only way out of economic problems but it's not. you are ignorant, my be best you stop talking.
April 3, 2009 at 12:09 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
icbmman (anonymous) says...
AMAZING, your posts really are "amazingly" stupid. You do realize that Michigan has become a cesspool of government corruption, union corruption, and deteriorating workforce, all of which was provoked through the many years of placating to unions as excessive taxes literally sucked the life out of the state? Michigan's situation is far different from SC's.
Of course the governor if MI wants the stimulus money...she has been totally inept at generating new business and job creation through her policies of bloated government programs. She'll spend that money and will ask for more in 4 years, mark my words.
Apparently, ignorance and idiocy are accepted mental states for the leftists/statists.
April 3, 2009 at 12:31 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
PersicaPit (anonymous) says...
Sandnateater:
Actually, I grew up right here in Charleston. I spent grades K-12 in Charleston County public schools, where I languished without proper guidance and studied outdated textbooks in moldy classrooms. Granted, things have improved since my graduation nine years ago, but we're still a long way from ideal learning conditions for our children.
I'm also quite familiar with the range of geographic problems our city faces as far as drainage issues go -- just as I know that a city built barely above sea level and mostly on marshland will never be "flood-free," I also know that there ARE areas in this city which should not flood but ARE flooding. Take a look at what happened in Bridge Pointe yesterday and tell me that's not an issue which could be corrected by a drainage overhaul.
Spending is not the only way out of economic problems. However, investing in our future -- in our infrastructure, our education system -- can in fact stimulate our economy, and history has proven as such.
You may presume to call me ignorant, sir -- but is it not also ignorant to blindly assume things about others and then dismiss their opinions under false assumptions? And while you may advise me to stop talking, I'd advise you to KEEP talking -- and keep listening. While we may share different opinions, there is nothing more enlightening than honest discourse.
April 3, 2009 at 12:37 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
sandnateater (anonymous) says...
This comment was removed by the site staff for violation of the usage agreement.
April 3, 2009 at 12:14 p.m. ( permalink | )
vuduchld (anonymous) says...
Heard the latest? Sanfraud is writing another letter to Obama, asking him if he can rob the graves of confederate taliban to help pay down his states debt! LOL
April 3, 2009 at 12:58 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Luna (anonymous) says...
Sanford is only out for himself and should be impeached.
April 3, 2009 at 1:02 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Enough (anonymous) says...
Let's face is. Sandford has done and abissmal job at running this state. It seems though as far as Republicans are concerned that would make him an excellant candidate for president.
April 3, 2009 at 1:07 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Luna (anonymous) says...
Yep, if you can screw up and take no blame you might just be a republican.
April 3, 2009 at 1:16 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
icbmman (anonymous) says...
This comment board (as well as the rest of this state and nation) has truly been taken over by the idiots. Sieg heil, comrades.
April 3, 2009 at 1:21 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Luna (anonymous) says...
Been buying guns and making more tin foil hats I see IC.
April 3, 2009 at 1:26 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
AMAZING (anonymous) says...
Moron Marky Mark will ask for the stimulus, but not all of it, while continuing to scream (and I hear he's been screaming for the last two weeks) about SC Sen. Hugh Leatherman's "obstructionism" as he continiues to blame somebody else for the hole he's dug for himself.
This claim is, as usual, more of the same nonsensical script he's used for his entire career in elective office.
It just goes to show you that Mark "moron" Sanford (who's made a political career, but not accomplished anything, out of saying "no" to any kind of government spending) has finally had his antics catch up with him.
I'll be generous and suspect that Sanford was betting the General Assembly would just do an end-around him and his "principles" as usual and then he could prance around the Sunday talk shows proudly declaiming his "fiscal conservative" credentials to any other freepers, libertarians and Laffer Curve nitwits who cared to tune in.
Why, one might ask? Because it's always worked in the past.
Not this time, Mark Sanford, you are a moron.
April 3, 2009 at 1:30 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
sandnateater (anonymous) says...
SC is just fine. Now get on up the road little girl if you don't like it here.
April 3, 2009 at 1:35 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Luna (anonymous) says...
Usual response from a usual suspect. If it were up to people like you we would still be reading by candle light and using outhouses.
Get with the times or time will leave you behind.
April 3, 2009 at 1:40 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
AMAZING (anonymous) says...
Luna
"reading by candle light and using outhouses."
Were you refering to South Carolina schools?
April 3, 2009 at 1:43 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Luna (anonymous) says...
YEP! The good ole boys in Columbia have not represented their poorer constinuents' needs in decades....if ever.
April 3, 2009 at 1:49 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
icbmman (anonymous) says...
>>Posted by Luna on April 3, 2009 at 1:26 p.m. (Suggest removal)
Been buying guns and making more tin foil hats I see IC.<<
Hardly, Luna. Though there is now a need for me to buy some guns in the near future. Let me guess, you'll depend on Mein Fuhrer to protect you...and feed you, and clothe you, and give you health, and shelter you.......
Don't forget to kiss the ring of the health czar whenever you need to go the hospital.
Uninformed communist sheep. Just what the radicals in office want you to be.
April 3, 2009 at 2:20 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Luna (anonymous) says...
Pinko commies are taking over the world!
Buy guns, stock extra food, not only tinfoil hats, shucks lets line the entire house!
Fear begets fear! And you sound like one scared cat!
No, I think I will work for everything I have the same way I always have. I do not need assistance, but that does not stop me from seeing the REAL needs in this state.
Maybe, just maybe, if you thought about someone other than you and yours you could become part of the human race.
Nope, I think the walking upright thing passed you by!
April 3, 2009 at 2:28 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Whopper (anonymous) says...
For all you self-righteous perfect people who hate this state, don't let the door hit you in the butt on your way back to whereever you mutts came from. We don't need you and apparently the society you left behind did not either. We would prefer it if you would just say thanks for the very freedom that this great state provided you. If it was not for SC, you yellow wimps would still be ruled by the Queen. This is called a debate. If you mutts can't debate without stereotyping or insulting this great state, then shut your pie holes. It's none of your business anyway. SC will take the feds to court on whether they can force us to pay back $ we reject - - and it will win. It's the right thing to do but people who do not live by their principles would not understand that. Pink slip for Amazing please . . .propaganda lost.
April 3, 2009 at 2:30 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Luna (anonymous) says...
whopper - this is my home. So, no I will not be leaving.
Those that live in the past are doomed to repeat the past. I'd have to say the same thing to you:
Get with the times or time will leave you behind.
April 3, 2009 at 2:44 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
yird (anonymous) says...
We a have a certified community organizer as president who never made a notable responsible decision in his life that anyone can attest to.
We have a plagiarizing anti second amendment (wrote the so called assault weapons ban bill) vice president with a well documented case of foot in mouth disease.
We have an attorney general who as deputy attorney general under Reno demonstrated his strong anti second amendment stance by testifying before the fifth circuit court of appeals that the second amendment was no barrier to gun confiscation from anyone including on duty members of the National Guard.
He later filed an amicus (friend of the court) brief with the Supreme Court along with other clintonistas supporting the ban on handgun ownership in the Washington DC area.
We have a secretary of state who chose for her first job out of college to go work for a law firm on the west coast who's two main partners were, one a member of the communist party and one who was no longer a "member".
Even though she was never convicted she has a checkered past that few can match.
The treasury secretary doesn't think he has to pay taxes like the rest of us.
I could go on but the point is that this administration is the most dysfunctional collection of misfits to pollute the white house in decades,
And to top it off these anti American low life's are now positioning themselves to take over total control of the economy.
I don't need any input from Rush, Hannity or Donald Duck to determine on my own that these people are bent on destroying this country 'as we know it" and I hope to hell that they fail.
Maybe if a few saner heads like Governor Sanford had been in positions of power at the federal level the current democrat orchestrated financial free fall might not have occurred.
Dodd, Frank, and Reigns should be investigated for corruption, but with a leftist overseeing the justice department that will probably never happen.
April 3, 2009 at 4:01 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
MsSun (anonymous) says...
Amazing do you have a job? If you do maybe your employer should employ someone else who doesn't blog on line all day. Geez-no wonder you are anti-republican-you don't like to work.
April 3, 2009 at 7:10 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
AMAZING (anonymous) says...
Dear MsSun,
Is that your "A' game? Is that the best you can do?
BTW, I never said I was anti-republican. I am anti-fraud, anti-Sanfraud.
Also, I am anti-goons ...i.e messrs. goon Davis and goon Sawyer.
April 3, 2009 at 7:51 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
yird (anonymous) says...
Posted by AMAZING on April 3, 2009 at 7:51 p.m. (Suggest removal
I am anti-goons ...
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Me to, especially the goon in the oval office.
April 3, 2009 at 9:04 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
vuduchld (anonymous) says...
Yird wrote:
"Maybe if a few saner heads like Governor Sanford had been in positions of power at the federal level the current democrat orchestrated financial free fall might not have occurred."
He "genius", your state IS ALREADY in a financial free fall! Seems like you been taking way too much meth lately pilgrim. On the national scene about the only thing people like you and your "messiah" Sanfraud can do is clean elephant latrines which all of you lemmings will be doing if you follow this joke of a goobner!!
April 5, 2009 at 7:19 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
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