Photo was not hate crime, FBI says
A photo posted at a Web site that depicted two white men preparing to lynch a black man is not a violation of federal hate crime law, the FBI said Monday.
In the photo, one of the men was wearing a Ku Klux Klan hood and robe. A man with a noose around his neck appeared to be a white person in blackface. The photo was on the MySpace Web page on Friday but has been removed.
"The FBI is monitoring the investigation to determine if there is any violation of federal law," said Denise M. Taiste, FBI public affairs specialist. The photo is not a crime because it does not threaten an identified person, she said. She said elements of a hate crime include the threat or use of force, targeting a victim because of race or color and a motive to injure or intimidate. "At this time, none of the elements are present," she said.
Previous stories
Officials link photo, crosses; Disturbing MySpace image believed connected to a cross-burning suspect, published 09/20/08
Three arrested in cross-burning, published 09/13/08
Sheriff's office investigates cross-burning in rural area, published 09/10/08
The photo was brought to the attention of the Charleston County Sheriff's Office by Dot Scott, president of the Charleston chapter of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People. The Sheriff's Office referred the matter to the FBI because South Carolina does not have a hate crime law.
"It's unfortunate that's the case but I understand. There's not an identifiable victim. Maybe at some point, South Carolina can get some stronger laws. I'm pleased with what they have done this far," Scott said.
According to information on the MySpace page where the photo appeared, it was the site of Ravenel resident Chance Jones, 19. Robert Jarrett Chance Jones, 19, of Ravenel and two others were arrested Sept. 12 after police seized two wooden crosses that had been burned along a road between Meggett and the Petersfield community.
The Sheriff's Office believes that the Chance Jones it arrested is the same person who authored the Web site, but it does not know if he was in the photo that depicted a lynching.
Jones referred questions to his attorney, Paul Uricchio, who could not be reached for comment. Joseph Wayne Chaplin, 18, also was arrested Sept. 12. Nicholas George Jellyman, 17, of Meggett turned himself in that afternoon, police said.
State law makes it a crime to put a real or simulated flaming cross in a public place or on another person's property unless the property owner gives written permission. It is a misdemeanor that carries a possible one-year prison sentence and $500 fine.
Reach Prentiss Findlay at 937-5711 or pfindlay@postandcourier.com.
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Comments
10216340 (anonymous) says...
It may not have been a crime but it sure was hate.
September 23, 2008 at 6:34 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
DoaMM (anonymous) says...
Aren't all crimes "hateful"?
Have you ever known of a "loving" or "friendly" crime?
All crimes are hate crimes.
Stupid law...
September 23, 2008 at 6:54 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
StoptheMadness (anonymous) says...
Good Lord! I bet if you writing "stupid law", "don't support hate crime laws" had been a victim of one or you daughter, etc. you'd be singing a different tune. (But surely you can't even imagine living such an existance of being a minority in America, you being white and never having these expereinces--AND YES, I'M WHITE!)
The point is until WE ALL respect each other we'll have to keep putting laws on the books to protect us from each other. Evolve already!
September 23, 2008 at 8:13 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Deborrah (anonymous) says...
Why would anyone knowing the history of lynching not consider this a hate crime? Don't be surprise at their future.
September 23, 2008 at 8:42 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
StoptheMadness (anonymous) says...
Nowhere did I suggest all crimes should not be equally punished. Hate crime laws should strengthen that punishment. They encompass more than race; they include sexual orientation, disability, etc. I believe the raping of a disabled girl is an added level of heinous, deviant behavior and should be punished as such. That belief does not take away from the atrocity of rapes of nondisabled women. Jane, we're both entitled to our viewpoints and don't have to agree.
September 23, 2008 at 9:06 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
StoptheMadness (anonymous) says...
Your scenrio is hardly the same as weariing a KKK hood and wrapping a rope around a black man's neck. Luckily our court system uses a jury of our peers and not a blanket rule for every situation.
September 23, 2008 at 9:11 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
abc123 (anonymous) says...
I believe that the thought behind hate crime laws is that hate crimes may be more likely to lead to retaliatory crimes and cause tension in communities and neighborhoods. With harsher punishment for crimes that specifically target someone for their race, sex, ethnicity, etc, this may be prevented.
With that said, I think that many times crimes may be classified as hate crimes with little rhyme or reason (just because the crime may have been committed by a person of another race...not because they were specifically targeting that person because of race).I agree with Coldbeer on this one.
September 23, 2008 at 9:20 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
hotchick (anonymous) says...
I think someone is missing the point here. A hate crime deals with committing a crime toward someone simply because of that person's ethnicity, gender, or sexual orientation. There is no reason to commit the crime toward the person (such as during a robbery attempt) other than the fact that you just don't like that the person because he or she is of a different classification. Hate crimes do deserve more severe penalties. The people who commit them are sociopathic and, in many cases, they are so ingrained in their hatred for a certain group that they are a threat to all of society. Put them away. They have been brainwashed by others (parents? peers?) to believe that those who are different are the enemy.
We have digressed far from the original story. I am really saddened to learn that youths are still out there believing and promoting the bigotry of their ancestors. I had thought - and hoped - that the youth of today had finally understood that people are people regardless of their color and were turning away from the ignorance of their parents. I am a white Southern gal, born and raised right here in the Charleston area. 'Daughter of parents who still today think of African Americans as a lesser race, no matter what I try to say to dissuade them. In spite of what people might assume I believe due to my heritage, geographical location and race, I am a firm believer that Dr. King was right - - judge a person based on the strength of his character, not on the color of his skin.
September 23, 2008 at 9:26 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
abc123 (anonymous) says...
I do want to clarify that I feel that burning a cross should be considered a crime regardless of whether it was a 'joke' or intended to threaten someone.
September 23, 2008 at 9:30 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
draftdot (anonymous) says...
folks-it's not so complicated. these guys burn a cross & then appear in white robes w/ a noose.
if it looks like sh*t & smells like sh*t, it's definitely sh*t.
September 23, 2008 at 9:32 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
abc123 (anonymous) says...
Well said hotchick.
September 23, 2008 at 9:32 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
UrGatorbait (anonymous) says...
DoaMM and Coldbeer, well said.
Hotchick, excellent points but no crime is kind. The bigotry point is very good.
September 23, 2008 at 9:43 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
guidedbystewart (anonymous) says...
I swear it is easy to argue semantics, yet this avoids the real problem to why this still happens in this day and time. How did the parents feel when they heard the news? I would not doubt that they probably chuckled and made a comment "boys will be boys". Anyways, ignorance breeds ignorance, and until we look at all races as human beings and show some type of empathy for all types of people, this type of HATE will continue.
September 23, 2008 at 9:49 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
stephaniem (anonymous) says...
I like what hotchick said
I disagree with coldbeer as the black guy got shot for no reason and in cold blood and it was to persuade other black people from feeling safe.
The guy in the convenience store knew when he took the job that there was danger involved and that someone might shoot him w/o no hatred against him...just greed for the money or panic and make a gun accidently go off. Manslaughter with a robbery can get the same amount of years w/o the death penalty. Hate crimes should be acknowledged so people can see their own bigotry against people of color or different religion/lifestyles
If you take a job like police work, fireman, the graveyard shift or even take college classes at night--you accept more risks. They still go to jail but under different charges.
I am going into the medical field, I assume the risk that I will be around lots of sick people and overworked. I know this going in.
September 23, 2008 at 9:52 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
msplacedinsc (anonymous) says...
Hotchick great post!
Let me ask you jane, when you crossed paths with these boys, did they say "hey you bi**h" or did they say "you are a bi**h" or maybe you caught them in mid sentence talking about another person? Are you assuming they were talking to you because you were white and they were black? Did you even look up and see if they were even looking in your direction when they passed you on their bike (probably not)?
You can commit a crime out of hunger, greed, hate, ignorance, selfishness, passion, and so on and so on and so on.............get the picture?
September 23, 2008 at 9:54 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
annointed (anonymous) says...
Well said hotchick. When will we look at person for who they are and not what color they are. There are good and bad in every ethnicity and this story is a perfect example of that, however, I don't think that all Caucasian males or females feel or act this way, the same way I do not believe that every african american is going to rob me or kill me. People are people no matter what the race. Some just happen to be f*** up's and others happen to be productive citizens.
September 23, 2008 at 9:58 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
CHRISJIII (anonymous) says...
Hotchick thanks for adding some sanity and critical thinking to these posts.
September 23, 2008 at 10:01 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
annointed (anonymous) says...
msplacedinsc you went were I was about to go. Why was Jane singled out. I am sure there were many others on that walk way at the time. How do you automatically assume they are talking to you because you are white? No, seriously this is apart of the problem as well, we assume that we are always the victim. They could have been talking about anyone or to anyone, they could have been singing one of their songs that you have dubbed as "garbage". Take a look at self and stop being so offended without knowing the facts. Now don't get me wrong, I do disagree with the use of that word in any connotation , and certainly if they were speaking to or about you, then they were out of line and it is unacceptable. But it is also a part of today's society. That word has become fashionable when speaking about women and it is not only black boys/ young men that are using it. I have heard it used by young white males when they have been talking about their own mothers, is that acceptable or is that considered trash as well. How about when a female refers to another female as a b****? Is that trash as well and are you equally offended? We need to stop putting color to what is wrong and just recognize that it is wrong and needs to be addressed.
September 23, 2008 at 10:12 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
commonsence (anonymous) says...
"Hate crimes" are just another form of terrorism - designed to intimidate and scare members of the target group. The intent is more insidious than a "normal crime" although I'm not convinced that it should be a separate classification of offense. Just tack on more time...
September 23, 2008 at 10:31 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
annointed (anonymous) says...
The word is not only heard in lyrics. It's heard in movies and on t.v. and it's even heard in the homes of some of the most prominent people we all know. What we need to do is stop using the word ourselves and teach all children that the use of that word is unacceptable. Teach all children respect for themselves first, because if they don't have that how can they respect others? It takes a village to raise a child, but what happens if the village is broke, selfish or racist? Children are the products of their villages/ environments. When the adults grown-up, so will the children.
September 23, 2008 at 10:40 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
DoaMM (anonymous) says...
Once again, ALL crime is hate filled. Unfortunately it pretty much only works one way:
Any time a White man does ANYTHING to any other ethnicity, it will most likely be labeled a hate crime.
Not too far from the whole "racism" vs. "reverse racism" card played by folks. If a White man treats a Black man poorly, it's "racism". If a Black man Treats a White man poorly, it's called "reverse racism".
How stupid is that?
Racism is racism, just as all crimes are committed in a hateful nature.
September 23, 2008 at 11:19 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
JDHawg (anonymous) says...
Racism starts at home.If a child grows up hearing their parents,uncle,aunts,and other family member bad mouth another race they will more then likely turn do the same thing.and that goes for all races no matter what color they are.
September 23, 2008 at 11:30 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
SCHoser (anonymous) says...
The whole argument is stupid. People want racism to end, but the law in itself perpetuates the same racism. I agree with CBs post-both crimes deserve the same punishment. I couldn't disagree with Stephaniem's post more-actually, I think that is stupid to try and lessen the crime due to inherent danger. If that be the case, why do police and people get all worked up when a cop gets shot? I have never heard a prosecutor, defense attorney or investigator state that the killing of a cop-or any of the other jobs or the student-is not so bad because the victim knew the risks. All of your examples are stupid. Murder is murder! I couldn't care less why the crime is committed-the murderer should be put to death, end of story. You rob a store at gun point, and the gun goes off on accident, and you kill the clerk, death penalty. Time to get tuff on crime-ALL CRIME! Get rid of the racist laws, and treat everyone equally. Crime is crime, we should stop trying to label it and work together to solve it.
September 23, 2008 at 11:31 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
jimmy1370 (anonymous) says...
Hate Crime.....is it about the action or what the person was thinking while committing the action?
September 23, 2008 at 11:46 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
kontact (anonymous) says...
Let me get this right? Yesterday's post on murder victims death may had something to do with missing guns got a total of 5 posts while these white kids who burnt a cross and had kkk related material on their myspace account is the talk of the day? And yall actually think thats its not a hate crime-lets say its not and there is no such thing as a hate crime.THEY BURNED A CROSS IN SOMEONES YARD. Does this not ---I cant even write anthing else or play devils advocate because this is absolutly ludicris if you all think that they were just having fun. Tell you what-when there is a black on black crime the post are always negative and about what is going to happen to the suspects with the courts being lenient on them. When the kids get to school I promise(not wishing harm) and I mean promise that the black kids are probaly going to take justice into their own hands. Thats called being tried by a jury of your peers. ha ha Would anyone of you all want to be the when they get to school. A school that is predominatley black bing the location that they live in. I feel for them more now because thats going to be the most horrific punishment for the racit pigs that could happen to anyone.
September 23, 2008 at 12:37 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
geekboy (anonymous) says...
Posted by DoaMM on September 23, 2008 at 6:54 a.m. (Suggest removal)
Aren't all crimes "hateful"?
Have you ever known of a "loving" or "friendly" crime?
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%
Well, statutory rape comes to mind...
(The kind involving teenagers.... not the kind involving a teen and a waaay older perv)
September 23, 2008 at 12:43 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
eyfigueroa (anonymous) says...
Jane you are more than likely incorrect in your assumption. Once again you applied a racial overtone to a situation that did not warrant it.
"It was very clearly directed towards me and it was because I was white, at least I got the feeling if I had been a black woman they would not have said that."
So what would be your assumption about why two White kids called you that?
I have been called that word as have many other women of color BY people of color. What you have is a growing desensitization of our youth. That and other pejoratives are bandied about in music, comedy routines, TV and feature films. Children are NOT being taught by their parents grace, dignity or the simple rules of gentility. Our culture overall has become very coarse.
I've never been a proponent of the 'hate crime' designations. It's become about legislating thought. As Coldbeer so eloquently puts it "we already have laws in place to handle ALL of those crimes and that no one person is more valuable than any other and no one motive is any worse than any other."
"Should rappers be prosecuted for their lyrics about killing and raping bi**hes and hos? Isn't that a "Hate crime" against women?" (NO and NO) That may be your opinion Jane, but thankfully our constitution isn't based on the opinion of someone who would automatically believe that Black people would simply call you a bitch because you're White as opposed to just believing that you are one.
Again, legislating thought and speech shouldn't be the goal. The goal should be to encourage proper parenting so the adults can offset the terrible message (yes, a lot of rap today is terrible) that is being blasted at our young people.
The goal should be to QUICKLY and SEVERLY punish those who break the law.
And do so without additional designations that only serve to diminish victims of similar crimes.
September 23, 2008 at 12:45 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Lovely_One (anonymous) says...
To add to Eyfig's post, also Jane, you said that those boys would not have called a black woman a bitch, but we know that to be false because they do it all the time in the rap lyrics. Isn't that one of the things that was mentioned earlier?
September 23, 2008 at 1:28 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
chris50 (anonymous) says...
i find it funny that everyone assumes that Jane was false in her assumption that black kids called her a bitch.
it's true. no one believes that hate crimes can be committed by colored people. (not that it is one, but the sentiment is similar)
September 23, 2008 at 2:42 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Lovely_One (anonymous) says...
chris, I wasn't saying that I didn't believe Jane. Those little so and so's could have very well called her a bitch and I wouldn't put it past them. I was merely saying that she was probably incorrect in feeling that a "if [she] had been a black woman they would not have said that" because we are called bitches by those same types of black men all the time.
September 23, 2008 at 2:50 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
eyfigueroa (anonymous) says...
Chris50: 'colored people'
I want to thank you for giving me a chuckle. Believe it or not I have more respect for you being open and honest about how you feel about Black people than those who would hide behind certain 'code' words.
I'm sure the people you call 'colored' to their face also appreciate your candor.
Blacks, Whites, Hispanics, Jews, Arabs, et al can all be prejudiced, bigoted and yes racists. No one with any modicum of common sense or intelligence can dispute that.
I merely stated that Jane quite often puts a racial connotation on many articles that do not warrant it. The very same boys MAY HAVE called her a b*tch because she is White. However they may have called her that simply because either her behavior or the look she gave them warranted them to call her what she acted like.
Who knows?
But her statement, "It was very clearly directed towards me and it was because I was white, at least I got the feeling if I had been a black woman they would not have said that" is such a BLANKET generalization of Blacks that I felt compelled to respond.
She made an assumption based solely on the color of the skin of the boys. She never did answer the hypothetical of what would she have thought if White boys called her that.
By the way I went over the posts and I didn't find ANYONE that disputed that the boys called Jane a name. Please take the time to thoroughly read the posts before commenting on them.
September 23, 2008 at 4:08 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Lovely_One (anonymous) says...
eyfig, I totally missed the "colored people" comment. dang! It's like that!!!
September 23, 2008 at 4:50 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
kontact (anonymous) says...
I take it jane that you must be one heck of a B!tc( because its true -no one defended that. <---coming from the young black dude
September 23, 2008 at 4:56 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
eyfigueroa (anonymous) says...
Yes, lovely lady, it's like that! And that's the way it is! »
Man, you gotta love this website.
I say we throw a party and invite EVERYONE and watch the melee begin!
But most of these people wouldn't dare come much less say in our faces what they post on this board.
September 23, 2008 at 5:01 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Lovely_One (anonymous) says...
Eyfig,
And you that's the truth. They say what they say behind the anonymity of this board and that is where much of it will stay. Now you will have those that will come and try to sugarcoat what they say here and try to explain it away.
I don't know why I allow these comments to surprise me but, alas, it does. In your favorite gesture....sigh*!~
September 23, 2008 at 7:06 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Carolina_Politics (anonymous) says...
We have a right to free speech in this country even that means entertaining the expressions of bottom of the gutter rednecks like Mr. Chance Jones who posted the photograph. The picture wasn't a direct threat towards any one individual so there is no crime. It's just an ignorant kid showing the rest of the world exactly that.
http://www.carolinapoliticsonline.com...
September 23, 2008 at 8:42 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
eyfigueroa (anonymous) says...
No RW, I don't believe you would say to me in my face what you say on this board.
Though I truly believe that you WOULD get into certain debates and state your position with conviction I highly doubt some of the things you 'safely' type on this board are anything that you would possibly say to my face.
IMHO only a coward calls a man a f*ggot or a woman a b*tch (or other such words) without truly knowing them. And sir many of your posts do just that, especially if someone posts something you disagree with.
For all of the very VALID points you try to make, you are no better than the other posters who use nasty personal attacks whenever someone disagrees with them.
So continue to be the other side of the JohnQ coin. Like you said you care less about what others think of you so continuing to act like a 'Mr. Keyboard Tough Guy' shouldn't be a problem.
Again Mr. RW, I in no way feel you have the courage to say to me in my face what you so colorfully post on this website.
So I guess you'll be knocking my teeth down my throat eh?
September 24, 2008 at 11:07 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
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