Riley open to fire talks
Union leader calls partnership with city 'unlikely'
By Ron Menchaca , Glenn Smith
The Post and Courier
Harold A. Schaitberger
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Charleston Mayor Joe Riley said Thursday he is willing to sit down and listen to ideas offered by union leaders pushing to give city firefighters a greater voice in how their department is run.
Riley's statements came about two hours after the head of the nation's largest firefighters' union visited Charleston and pledged to put the full force of his organization's financial, political and legal resources behind local firefighters.
Harold Schaitberger, general president of the Washington-based International Association of Fire Fighters, said union leaders would prefer to work cooperatively with the city and fire officials to bring about change in the wake of last year's Sofa Super Store fire that killed nine Charleston firefighters.
But he said union leaders are well-versed in bringing pressure to bear on the city should Charleston officials rebuff their overtures.
"We would rather there be a partnership," he said. "I think that is unlikely, but I will hold out hope."
Riley said that South Carolina, as a right-to-work state, bars municipalities from engaging in collective bargaining with unions. But the mayor said he would be happy to meet with union leaders and hear any suggestions they have.
"We are always interested in information and ideas," he said. "My door is always open to anyone."
A panel of experts hired by the city recommended last year that fire officials establish relationships with outside organizations such as the firefighters union, which represents roughly half of the department. But meetings between the two sides would constitute nothing short of a sea-change in a long relationship marked by distrust and division.
In the past Riley has been somewhat dismissive of the union, painting it as a minority voice with no firm status in the Fire Department. For its part, the union has twice backed candidates who tried to unseat Riley, and its officials have unsuccessfully pushed for the ouster of Fire Chief Rusty Thomas.
Skepticism was evident in some of Schaitberger's remarks, which followed a pair of closed-door meetings with local firefighters at the International Longshoremen's Association Hall on Morrison Drive.
He said firefighters continue to struggle with pain, anger and fear in the aftermath of the June 18 blaze. Many aren't satisfied with the pace of change or convinced that the city is sincere in its efforts to reform an "autocratic command system" with outdated tactics, equipment and practices, he said.
Schaitberger came to Charleston with a contingent of national, regional and state union leaders. He said they wanted to demonstrate the union's commitment to help city firefighters through this time. He also wanted to express the union's hope that the city-appointed panel of experts is allowed to release its upcoming report on the sofa store fire without the findings being "filtered and watered down" by Charleston leaders.
City officials "massaged" language in the panel's first report last year, and the union doesn't want to see that happen again, he said.
Riley said he has not received a copy of the panel's upcoming report. He said the community should have faith in the expertise of the six-member panel, headed by former Louisiana Fire Chief Gordon Routley. That report is expected next month.
The Charleston Firefighters Association, which in the 1970s could claim a large majority of the department among its membership, lost much of its clout in the Riley era, to the point where the union faded away around 1980.
But in the wake of the sofa store fire, increasing numbers of firefighters see the union as a possible force for change. Roger Yow, president of the local union, said its rolls stood at about 100 members before June 18. Today the union has about 125 members, including several new members who joined as part of this week's meetings with the national union representatives.
Schaitberger said he is sensitive to the fact that some may view his visit as the "union boss" from Washington coming in to make demands and stir up trouble. "We are not coming in to light a fire and leave," he said. "That's not the way we are going to achieve success."
Kevin Prin, an assistant engineer at the Cannon Street fire station, said the visit by national leaders was inspirational and reassuring to the local members. "It was upbeat, motivational. I think the guys are glad they're in it and motivated to bring more people in."
Reach Glenn Smith at 937-5556 or gsmith@postandcourier.com. Reach Ron Menchaca at 937-5724 or rmenchaca@postandcourier.com.
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bjp99 (anonymous) says...
"He said the community should have faith in the expertise of the six-member panel"
How can we have faith in a report that will be able to be changed if it doesn't meet the approval of Mr. Riley and Mr. Thomas?
March 28, 2008 at 1:06 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Paul (anonymous) says...
As stated before, nothing will change until Riley & Rusty are gone ...
March 28, 2008 at 6:24 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
theronce (anonymous) says...
I do not know what the solutions are and cannot predict the future. But, it cannot hurt if everyone sits down to talk about what is and what needs to be done. Make to opposing positions list of disagreements public and let the people decide what they are willing to pay for.
March 28, 2008 at 7:35 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
captivated (anonymous) says...
How dare you union people come into the Kingdom of Riley with your highhanded talk of improvements and modernization! Luckily for you The good king will allow a few seconds of his precious time to "listen" to your inane prattle! Be short with your mouthings lest He will have to unloose his 1st knight Sir Rusty upon you!
March 28, 2008 at 8:09 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
CHRISJIII (anonymous) says...
Don't hold your breath waiting for any changes to come about in this situation. Maybe the state should get away from the "right to work" mess. It's like one of the last vestiges of the plantation system.
March 28, 2008 at 9:42 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
crankyyankee (anonymous) says...
Change is coming my friends! Change is coming.
March 28, 2008 at 10:17 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
firefightersforthetruth (anonymous) says...
The Mayor stated on ch. 5 news that the investigation of the SSS fire has been open and transparent. Joe you have lied so much you do not know how to tell the truth. If it is open and transparent then why have not allowed your own city council to have any input. On Tuesday's night meeting Rev. Gallant ask again, has head of the city's safety commitee, to be able to address the Routley commision. You told him they would not and have not been in town together. T THAT DEAR JOE WAS ANOTHER LIE! They were here for three days the week before to make a desion on the new training Chief. You did not trust your friend Rusty to make that desision, so the panel had to do it.
STOP THE LIES AND BS JOE, I BELIEVE YOU ARE STARTING TO SUFFER FROM DEMENTIA BECAUSE YOU CAN NOT EVER SEEM TO REMEMBER WHAT YOU HAVE SAID TO OTHERS.
God bless our nine lost brothers, their memory desireve more than a cover up of poor leader ship by the city!
March 28, 2008 at 10:21 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
tfd64Lt (anonymous) says...
To all City of Charleston firefighters...the recent arrival of the IAFF IS GREAT NEWS FOR YOUR FIREFIGHTERS!! You need all the allies you can get to assure TRUE PROGRESS toward increased safety and all of the things your leader(?)should have provided you with long ago. Of course every organization has its positives and negatives, however, given who heads your department (and his style of so called leadership), the IAFF WILL BE A TRUE team player and they will look out for YOU!! Best of Luck!!!!
March 28, 2008 at 10:22 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
vesta (anonymous) says...
Mr. Shaitberger: In November over 60% of the city citizens voted Riley back into office. I know, that is difficult to believe. I am guessing a great percentage of pro-Riley voters are in the upper class. Someone suggested a temporary boycott of the peninsula back in September or October. Tourism brings in big bucks and, a lack of tourism dollars places a heavier tax burden on the wealthy. Perhaps then the upper class would sit up, take notice and demand something be done to bring the CFD in line with standards and safety. The Riley Report (f/k/a the Routely Report)has been a paving element for the harsh NIOSH report yet to be released. Everyone else (with the exception of the city management, and many upper level chiefs of the CFD) seems concerned and on board to the FFs' plight. A "right to work" state does not have to be a "good chance to die" state for the honorable FFs of our area. Thank you for your interest in our FFs lives.
March 28, 2008 at 10:50 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Edwin435 (anonymous) says...
I don't like unions....never have and never will. They tend to make employers coddle bad employees and are resistant to all changes that privately owned businesses need to make in order to be more profitable in the work place. In most cases these profits will help workers out with better benefits and pay. Granted there are crappy employers out there just like there are crappy unions out there but my experience as a whole with unions has been one of " thats not my job" and " you will have to call another union to get that done". I have traveled to shows where in order to get your booth set up requires so much crap that I will never go to another one. ( particularly up north ). So much wasted effort to get something done that will eventually profit everyone. Think about that before you climb into bed where decisions about your livelihood will be made without your consent. I cant pay into something that will largely be useless. Good luck !
March 28, 2008 at 10:57 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Beerkrugul (anonymous) says...
I see nothing wrong with Riley, Thomas and two union officials sitting down and discussing what progress (if any)has been made. I would like also to see two impartial individuals from the community invited.
As for Roger Yow, I think he's tooting his horn for national recognition.
March 28, 2008 at 11:44 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
theronce (anonymous) says...
I have been a union member and a manager across the table from that same union. My experience with both sides is good and bad. Unions do tend to get the rank and file more money and a safer work environment. However, unions tend to be less truthful than management and tend to limit a business's ability to innovate, grow, and deal with the worst employees. Unions thrive where the workers are mistreated, overlooked, or uninformed. The city may eventually cause what it does not want.
March 28, 2008 at 12:40 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
FightingCocks (anonymous) says...
BeerKrugul: "As for Roger Yow, I think he's tooting his horn for national recognition"
Roger Yow does what he does because he cares about his fellow firefighting brothers! He spent 25 years in the CFD and had to deal with the same things that CFD firefighters are dealing with today. He is retired now, yet dedicates his life to fighting for the safety and rights of his brothers in the fire dept... Whats wrong with that???... Hell, if he does get a little national attention at least he will get something out of all of this...
March 28, 2008 at 1:34 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
cfdiaffman (anonymous) says...
BeerKrugul
You apparently know nothing about Capt. Yow or what your talking about. Yow doesn't earn a dime for what he does for the firefighters. Yet he is doing what the cowards or the citizens won't do and that to protect and make it better for us. You said "I would like also to see two impartial individuals from the community invited." Who would that be? Two more of Riley's yes men. Capt. Yow and the IAFF aren't going away. Riley needs to get use to it or do the right thing and get Rusted Thomas out of there. Retire him Joe. Now.
March 28, 2008 at 6:07 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
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