Drive seeks to alter S.C. constitution
Group wants more than minimum for schools
Learn more about the petition to change the state's constitution, go to: goodbyeminimallyadequate.com.
South Carolina's public education system has its share of problems. It ranks among the worst in the country by a number of measures, and the decrepit condition of its poor, rural schools along Interstate 95 led some to dub the area the "Corridor of Shame."
The quality of Palmetto State schools has implications for its economy and citizens' welfare, and some say the place to start addressing this issue is by making a fundamental change to the state constitution, specifically to change the educational standard interpreted as "minimally adequate" to "high quality."
But others say that making such a change would open the state to lawsuits about the amount of money it spends on education, and that it would give the courts authority to order the Legislature to tax the public. They say that's unacceptable.
It's a debate about the state's education system and whether the Legislature is providing enough money for it. It's a discussion about the priority that South Carolinians are willing to put on education and back up with their tax dollars.
The stimulus for this conversation is a petition that supports changing the state constitution from requiring that the state provide a free public education system to mandating that it offer a "high quality education, allowing each student to reach his highest potential." The goal for the group behind this campaign is to get one million South Carolinians' signatures to push lawmakers to support the amendment.
Two-thirds of the state Senate and House would have to vote in favor of the changes, and the public would have to give its approval. Organizers hope a public vote will happen in November 2010.
Some, such as Senate President Pro Tem Glenn McConnell, R-Charleston, say they wouldn't support the amendment. He said he has no problem with making the state's goal to give children an education to the highest potential, but he has a problem putting such wording in the constitution because of problems it would create.
"It would be an erosion of our representative system of only those elected by the public being able to impose taxes on the public," he said.
Someone could sue the state and say it's not providing a high quality education, McConnell said. If the courts agreed with the plaintiff, judges could order the Legislature to provide more money to schools, he said.
Judges don't have information about competing interests facing the state, such as health care, law enforcement and higher education, and theirs would be a tunnel-vision decision on one issue, he said. Lawmakers are accountable to the public every election, and this is an attempt to get through the courts what's not gotten through the Legislature, he said.
"I'm not going to fall for that bait," he said. "It's a Trojan horse. You can't spend something you don't have, and the public does not want general tax increases."
The state already has been in court fighting a lawsuit filed by 36 districts that challenges the money provided by the General Assembly for education. The state Supreme Court has interpreted the constitution to mean the state must provide children access to at least a "minimally adequate" education, and some districts contend the state has not done that. The state Supreme Court heard the case two weeks ago and is expected to make a decision this fall.
Nationally, lawsuits challenging state funding for public schools have been filed in 45 states, according to the National Access Network. States vary in the language used to describe the obligation to provide education, according to a 2002 survey by the Education Commission of the States. Some states, such as Florida, Illinois and Virginia, require the state to provide a "high quality" system, according to the survey. Many others, such as Maine, Michigan and Mississippi, simply mandate the state provide free public schools.
Bud Ferillo, an organizer of this petition and director of the "Corridor of Shame" documentary, said the amendment would set the highest standard possible for South Carolina's education system. If the state meets its responsibility for the higher standard, lawsuits will not be necessary, he said. The issue is raising the bar for schools' performance, and the state constitution is the best way to do it, he said.
"Minimally adequate is no way to run any public service, especially the most important," Ferillo said. "We've already had 15 years of litigation under minimally adequate. ... Students are going to need an excellent education system to free us from the poverty and lack of success that we have been plagued with for over a century."
McConnell said he didn't think one million people would sign the petition if they understood it would give the courts the authority to raise taxes.
He didn't think the people of his voting district would support that, and he said he wished the state's standard simply would be to provide the opportunity for public education instead of "minimally adequate."
State Education Superintendent Jim Rex said surveys have shown a majority of South Carolina residents want more resources and emphasis on education and are "way ahead" of policymakers. They see the effects of good education, and the question is whether they can influence lawmakers, he said.
"I just hate to see us not making the investment that's going to have a remarkable payoff," he said.
Although it's a somewhat symbolic change, the phrase "minimally adequate" sends a message of low expectations and that needs to change, Rex said. Other aspects of the state's system also have to improve, but this change can be the catalyst and reminder of "why we're doing these things."
Juan-Carlos Foust, a rising senior at Academic Magnet High in Charleston County, recently signed the petition. He feels grateful to attend a high achieving school but feels discouraged with the standard of minimally adequate, he said. He questioned whether South Carolinians want minimally adequate education so they can live minimally adequate lives.
"One directly influences the other," he said. "That doesn't really make sense. ... I think people are willing and definitely interested in this happening."
Reach Diette Courrégé at 937-5546 or dcourrege@postandcourier.com.
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Comments
Pols101 (anonymous) says...
Money and a nice building does not make a student smart!
July 14, 2008 at 1:43 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
steve (anonymous) says...
"Some, such as Senate President Pro Tem Glenn McConnell, R-Charleston, say they wouldn't support the amendment. He said he has no problem with making the state's goal to give children an education to the highest potential, but he has a problem putting such wording in the constitution because of problems it would create.
... Someone could sue the state and say it's not providing a high quality education, McConnell said. If the courts agreed with the plaintiff, judges could order the Legislature to provide more money to schools, he said."
Oy vey!
Is this the same politico who was so in favor of that anti-gay, anti common-law marriage amendment?
Stand828 is like the Mark Twain of the P&C Comments.
July 14, 2008 at 5:21 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
hartley8184 (anonymous) says...
Hello? You have a problem with McConnell opposing this meaningless change of wording with a meaningFULL perversion of our constitution???? Hello? You have a problem with the idea that only elected officials should have the power to levy taxes? Sounds like a kneejerk reactionary panic attack to me, just cause McConnell's a Republican.
Anyway, this sob story is the oldest trick in the book. South Carolina is at the bottom of the barrel, but, that bottom ain't to far from the top of the barrel... meaning that the whole country has a crappy education system. Detroit has a 75 percent dropout rate. The national dropout rate is 53 percent. The national SAT average is c minus. And SC is just a tad below that average.
I'm not about to support the idea of giving judges the power to levy taxes at will. Money isn't the problem. It never has been.
July 14, 2008 at 6:04 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
moonpie (anonymous) says...
rural schools along Interstate 95 led some to dub the area the "Corridor of Shame."
I wonder why? The I-95 corridor runs thru some of the poorest counties in SC. IN those counties you will find some of the poorest housholds in SC. Just go to the SC DOE site and compare test scores of the schools that receive the most free lunches to the schools that get the least free lunches.
It's about economics and race (no matter if you like that or not) NOT how much money we give to the schools or the building they're in.
July 14, 2008 at 6:23 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
grannyofsix (anonymous) says...
Stand828 writes a post same as Coldbeer hmmmm
July 14, 2008 at 7:03 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Paul (anonymous) says...
I was in the public school system ~40 years ago after moving here from Fl. After only two years I was two years behind in Math skills and had to take summer school and accelerated courses to catch up before High School.
Nothing has changed.
July 14, 2008 at 7:32 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Tulane75 (anonymous) says...
I was going to respond to stand828, but I can't figure out what he/she said. What is that, a screen play?
July 14, 2008 at 7:39 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
lillycollette (anonymous) says...
McCONnell feigns concern about the Supremes hypothetically being capable of raising taxes for education -- while he and the legislature ignores their scheme of double taxation through the family court.
SC Code. § 20-7-952 only allows a man -- "who claims to be the father of a child" -- a statutory right to -- "initiate" -- a paternity action.
The tax paying man who is -- falsely accused of paternity -- can find himself being doubly taxed under guise of child support for another man's bastard and denied all redress of grievances.
If McCONnell has doubts about the judiciary why isn't he pressing for them to be held -- "accountable to the public every election" -- just like the legislature (supposedly) is?
July 14, 2008 at 7:44 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
oldglory (anonymous) says...
"Corridor of Shame", indeed. Shame, shame on South Carolina.
July 14, 2008 at 7:48 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
MP (anonymous) says...
You cannot teach people who do not want to learn no matter how much money you spend. Figure out how to spend the money on those who honestly want an education and then we'll talk about such a major expense to the taxpayers. I have plenty of friends who are frustrated teachers. Many more who already quit the profession since they were not being allowed to teach because of the troublemakers and constant disruptions in the classroom. This and a system that did not permit them to discipline or eject the problems. Our education system is now nothing more than a taxpayer funded day care. That is all.
July 14, 2008 at 7:49 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
suec (anonymous) says...
If parents don't follow up and get involved in their kids education on a personal level, all the money the world is not going to fix this. Instead of staging protest marches and getting face time on TV and PnC, they need to make sure their kids get their homework done, behave in school and get good report cards.
If your child gets to middle school without learning to read, it is as much the parents fault as the schools. Pay attention parents! If you kid is 8 and can't read then you had better get on the ball.
July 14, 2008 at 7:57 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
theronce (anonymous) says...
Actually, I think that maybe we ought to cut back on spending until we see some concrete improvement. More money has not worked in the past. Maybe less money will help or at least conserve the resource until the education industry and hands-off parents get their act together.
July 14, 2008 at 8:08 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
asdpe (anonymous) says...
I just knew it, when I saw this article posted, that we'd get to enjoy yet another set of tirades from the "SC schools stink and no amount of money will fix them" crowd. But thanks, stand828 for your hilarious comments, loved it!
I, too, went to SC public schools, graduating 20 years ago, and I needed no summer school, no extra help to prepare me for college, etc. In fact, I went on to attend a very well-regarded university and had no trouble there either.
But the problems in the Corridor of Shame (which is not where I went to school) are just horrendous, and absolutely unacceptable. Anyone who hasn't seen that documentary about those schools should have to see it before they can comment on this. And yes, that area is one of the poorest areas in the state, no argument there. So more money by itself won't necessarily fix the problem, but fixing the way money for schools is raised and distributed is the way to go.
If a child lives in a poor county or community, he/she suffers doubly because the tax base in that area can't raise enough money to even provide that "minimally adequate" school that the Constitution requires. Why is this fair? The money ought to be divided equally, NOT based on the financial well-being of the area in which the school is located.
July 14, 2008 at 8:10 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
nikkiP (anonymous) says...
mmm, of course it's about race. It's always about race, because heaven forbid anyone be held accountable for their actions or the actions of those they are responsible for.
i graduated high school in 2005, and I don't see money as the problem. Not to mention, I do not like the idea of my taxes being raised that frequently. I alread die on the inside everytime I get my paystub and look at the money they've taken out to go to welfare and such. you know the problem with american education?
The students. And their parents. Most of my friends now that attend college, it's because their parents pushed them to it. Some families knew they could afford it, some couldn't. Most of us had to apply for several scholarships and grants, which puts a good bit of emphasis on middle and high school.
Just think about this: In America, we have truency officers. Kids act up in class, get suspended, skip school, and where are the parents when this is going on? Parents need to instill in their children a desire to learn and do something with their lives. Want to talk about free lunches? Well, how many of those school with the worst test scores also have students who threaten teachers, are violent during the school day, or may skip class?
Also, if we do have to give more funding, let's give it to the honors or AP programs. Even IB, though we don't have those here. If you want a good way to produce a quality and intelligent youth, you have to establish programs that will challenge them.
July 14, 2008 at 8:20 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
shoelaces (anonymous) says...
You don't have to go all the way to I95 to find "inadequate" schools. Go to Johns Island, N.Chuck, or downtown Charleston. The difference is that when a school is tucked away out of public view the public has no idea what sort of condition the school may be in.
I am a teacher and I have never believed inteh war cries of MORE MONEY. I do believe to an extent the building has a lot to do with the quality of instruction. We have had numerous teachers and students become ill due to poor air quality in our building.
When I get high quality parents with high quality children then my high quality of teaching pays off tremendously. Likewise when I am given poor quality parents with poor quality children my high quality teaching doesn't go quite as far.
Sometimes you can't turn lemons into lemonade but you can make the lemons a little bit sweeter and money doesn't do it.
July 14, 2008 at 8:35 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
shoelaces (anonymous) says...
Many schools do ask parents pay an "activity fee" each year. Somewhere around $40. I know that isn't any "real" money but it is something. However, the schools that are Title 1 schools don't charge a fee. Again, these are the schools with the highest poverty level and most free lunches. That means those "poor" families are allowed to ditch their small monetary responsibility along with many other responsibilities.
nikkip...good thinking from someone who still has the taste of high school in her mouth. And there is an IB program at Buist in the middle school. They are going to start it in the elementary level eventually.
tripsa....where do you think all that money is going ??? Higher ups who never even step foot in a classroom most of the year. Paying for the Taj Majal on Calhoun. I personally believe that building could be sold for profit and the staff could go someplace cheaper. It's a pain to get to anyway. And you have to pay to park!!!
July 14, 2008 at 8:57 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
zekemire (anonymous) says...
First, the governments state or federal are not a slush fund to be used by whatever activist group wants to rape the general, or, should I say the taxpaying public! We should go to independent school districts such as in Texas! Let the taxpayers in those independent districts determine what they will spend and be taxed to support! It is criminal to take tax money from someone in York County to spend in schools in Dillon County, etc.! THIS IS SOCIALIST AND NOT VALID UNDER THE US OR STATE CONSTITUTIONS! ENOUGH! Taxpayers can only go so far! We alrealy have income, sales, accomodations, rental car, prepared foods, real property, personal property and many others! HOW MUCH IS ENOUGH????
July 14, 2008 at 9:12 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
guidedbystewart (anonymous) says...
I do agree with onething Early said, "Ignorance breeds ignorance". Isn't that zekemire, tripsa, gadsden, and Mouth of the Inbreeds, where ever he is.
July 14, 2008 at 9:31 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
shoelaces (anonymous) says...
tripsa....I know from past posts that you are for the lowly teacher :)
ColdBeer....WHACK!!! Sound of itting the nail squarely on the head.
We all pretty much know where the problems lie in education. The question is, how do any of us fix them???
July 14, 2008 at 9:32 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
nikkiP (anonymous) says...
Soooo, now guided is saying people in the south are all inbred? Is there a reason you're still in the south, then? I get very tired of people living here and enjoying life in the southeast and any benefits here while complaining that we're all dumb and inbred. I'm pretty sure I don't own any horses, I have cable, and my parents aren't related. Chances are, I'm smarter that you, will do better in my life, and will work harder. So if you don't mind, keep those comments to yourself. People going through the fastfood drive through don't need to hear your opinions, either. Just hand them the fries.
Not saying you work in fast food. Just saying that the majority of people who make claims that those of us in the south are all dumb, even though they also live in the south, need to learn some manners.
The teachers try. I know of a few that used to love their jobs, until they realized that the school administration will NOT back them up on anything or allow them to teach. One teacher I had in high school had a huge problem with kids threatening her frequently, and the admins never helped. She taught the tech prep classes (read: about the same level as learning disabled, except in this case the kids are just lazy.) and anytime she started a new lesson, she said the students would refuse to study or do homework because they thought the material was "dumb."
You're right, let's spend even more money on these kids that refuse to learn anything.
July 14, 2008 at 10:15 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
carolinadude (anonymous) says...
MEGGA DITTOS MY FRIENDS!!MORE MONEY DOES NOT MEAN BETTER EDUCATION!! Several of you mentioned privatization. I think that's not a bad idea. Secular educators no longer make learning their primary objective. Instead our government schools have become conduits to the minds of our youth, training them to be anti-God, antimoral, antifamily, anti-free enterprise and anti-American.
If the majority of parents and taxpayers were really aware of our schools' incredibly poor performance, we would experience the greatest taxpayers' revolt in the history of our country. If tax money were allocated on the basis of quality of education, many government schools would be closed down.
The good sign I see in governent education today is that its intellectual poverty is being exposed so widely that the public is beginning to demand reforms of these public servants (educrats) who would be our masters if we remain silent.
Congratulations to Senator McConnell who is refusing to bow to the whims of those who advocate a change in our state's constitution which most certainly would be to the detriment of our representative form of government as he so eloquently points out.
July 14, 2008 at 10:52 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
guidedbystewart (anonymous) says...
I was not referring to all people from the South and I definitely do not think that most people from the south are inbreed. Bye the way, I, myself am from the South. I was just referring to Mr. inbreed himself, Mouth of the South (I find his name to be an insult since he definitely doesn't represent my viewpoint as a southerner), and his backwoods ideology. You guys read way too far into things.
AS for the education system goes. I know you some you guys a have already assumed my thoughts before I have expressed them (yes I'm so radical and socialist), but many of the problems with our school system lies with the parents (Like I have said before, I do not follow any sort of individual doctrine or Ideology but take what I observe and use reason to base my opinion). If the parents don't push there kids, it doesn't matter how much money you put into the school system, they will more than likely not get a decent education.
Yet, our schools do need the proper resources and teacher salaries that are competitive with other states in the region. Comfortable facilities should also be provided to a point to where the environment is not a distraction to the learning process. When I was in school, we didn't have air condition (and this wasn't to long ago) and by the time May rolled around we were like the hell with this. So this I know from experience.
July 14, 2008 at 10:55 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
RTC (anonymous) says...
"Well, Joe, let me think," says Glenn, rubbing his chin (his own chin...you never know what McConnell is gonna rub when another man is around).
stand, just what are you tring to say? Do you know this man personally? To accuse someone of being a homosexual without the facts to back it up is wrong. McConnell is not a homosexual, and unless you can prove otherwise, that comment was totally out of line. I guess if a man never marries he is automatically classified as a homosexual.
July 14, 2008 at 10:55 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
guidedbystewart (anonymous) says...
Also Ingnorance is rampent on this site, and yes, it was meant it as an insult to certain bloggers(tripsa I am surprised you caught that, I thought it would go over your head).
July 14, 2008 at 11 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
guidedbystewart (anonymous) says...
What's the matter tripsa, you can dish it out the insults but you can not take them?
July 14, 2008 at 11:10 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
UrGatorbait (anonymous) says...
LMAO at Stewarts posts. When they start calling ya names Stewart and using what they consider clever rejoinders, it usually means they are out of ammo. If that doesn't work they are very good at setting up strawmen. Thanks for your posts Stewart.
July 14, 2008 at 11:19 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
jahowell (anonymous) says...
More money?! Ha! Charleston County Schools could have all the money in the world and yet still have islands of excellence amidst a sea of failure. The reason has nothing to do with the standards of the state, but rather the standards of the parents. Those parents who accept low skills get exactly that. Why do you think that Wando, Academic Magnet, and the School of the Arts are the only good high schools in the district?! It's because many parents of students at those schools tolerate nothing but excellence from their kids.
Rather than blaming "the system," parents who send their kids to low achieving schools should take responsibility and locally get involved in that which ought to be most precious to them: the education of their children. This means checking up on their child's progress regularly, insisting on completion of homework, and zero tolerance for disrespect toward staff members, who are there to provide their children with the means to improve virtually every aspect of the family's future.
How do I know? Not only am I a product of Charleston County Schools, but I taught in them, too. As a refugee from the region currently teaching elsewhere, I am grateful that I no longer am confronted with the sad results of "minimally adequate" expectations of parents.
July 14, 2008 at 11:32 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
halfsheli (anonymous) says...
There is an IB diploma program at James Island Charter High SChool.
July 14, 2008 at 11:35 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
nikkiP (anonymous) says...
jahowell, I love that you referred to yourself as a "refugee."
I worry for teachers that work in schools like that. If things were as bad as I've heard at my high school, I can only imagine how much worse things are at the charleston county schools. Maybe they need hazard pay, as well. When the little brat in the back of the classroom is causing a scene, it's kind of scary to attempt to reprimand him when there's a good chance he's carrying a weapon.
For all these parents of kids that are doing poorly in school, you ever wonder how many of those ask their kids questions such as "Did you finish your homework?" or "Do you have a test to study for?"
Once again, just like with the mothers on welfare and in government housing, stop taking my money. I don't work to support you! I want a thank you note.
July 14, 2008 at 11:49 a.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
lantanagurl (anonymous) says...
I'm all for the State being sued for inadequate education!!! Kentucky citizens did that over 15 years ago. The legislature deemed the entire educational system as unconstitutional. As a result the public education system was completely overhauled and a state that was ranked as one of the worst in the nation is now ranked at 15 or so. See what happens when people actually get off of their buttocks and DO something instead of just writing the newspaper to gripe? It's easy to sit here & type what changes need to be made. The question begs to be asked...what you YOU personally doing to make things better in this state besides griping about it?
July 14, 2008 at 12:06 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
halfsheli (anonymous) says...
Is agreement of another's post admission of one's own lack of ideas?
July 14, 2008 at 12:10 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
shoelaces (anonymous) says...
"MOUTH" actually emailed me at my home address the other day!!! I didn't know you could o that....still new to this posting thing.
So, what do we do to fix the problems in public education? As a teacher in the CCSD I find most of what I have to say falls on deaf ears. Or what I would like to say is too risky to say.
July 14, 2008 at 1:09 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
hoyce (anonymous) says...
They need to do a documentary on what these teachers go through with lack of parental involvement and kids that don't care. Let's be fair to everybody and see both sides to the story. Everybody preaches accountability, yet nobody is held accountable for their children or lack of involvement with their children. I think the problem goes deeper than wording in the constitution. Although I do agree that min adequate doesn't sound the best, why not do as the other states mention and say we will provide you with an education and you pick the degree of adequacy. You can lead a horse to water, but can't make them drink....
July 14, 2008 at 3:04 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
halfsheli (anonymous) says...
I know this much. My day is done, and I agree to drink a cold beer, listen to the thunder, and watch the lightening.
July 14, 2008 at 3:37 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
lou9 (anonymous) says...
Raise the sales tax another 1 or 2 percent, let the state legislature assign a per pupil dollar figure regardless of where they live or go to school (public or private) and let the state take over funding, get rid of these ineffective school boards and their tax and waste.
July 14, 2008 at 4:59 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
YankeeLiberal (anonymous) says...
Would anyone of the most of you who thinks there is no connection between school funding and student performance be willing to put your money (or lack thereof) where your mouths are and put your kids into one of the schools in question (the Corridor of Shame, N. Chas., downtown, etc?, just to test your theory? I would not. The public schools here are such that we may not stay. Refusing to pay more taxes for better schools will perpetuate the problem, many years into the future.
July 14, 2008 at 8:01 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
Pols101 (anonymous) says...
These people want to tax us to death. Anybody would be crazy to sign-on to this idea! The whole thing is being pushed by school employees that want the money to pad their pockets while the rest of us struggle.
July 14, 2008 at 9:47 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
asdpe (anonymous) says...
You don't think teachers struggle financially? PLEASE!!!!
Yep, I guess you've got it figured out......that's why my husband and I both went into education, to get rich off of the backs of the taxpayers.
Like Dr. Phil says, "how's that workin out for ya?" We've yet to see our riches.....how about the rest of you teachers?
July 14, 2008 at 10:46 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
rollo (anonymous) says...
The state is not responsible for providing your child the highest education possible, YOU are!
July 15, 2008 at 9:19 p.m. ( permalink | suggest removal )
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